Go Back   Male vs Female | The Mixed Wrestling Forum > Mixed Wrestling & Fighting > Wrestling & Fighting Discussion



Check out the latest release by Fight Pulse: Bianca vs Andreas.
Preview photos are available in this topic. Get this video at: Fight Pulse - MX-251.




View Poll Results: Which type of wrestling matches do you enjoy the most?
BJJ 534 43.38%
Classic 697 56.62%
Voters: 1231. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #101  
Old 25-Jul-17, 09:10
al89 al89 is offline
Senior Member
Points: 5,775, Level: 32 Points: 5,775, Level: 32 Points: 5,775, Level: 32
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Gender: Male
Posts: 454
Thanks: 462
Thanked 1,259 Times in 314 Posts
Default Re: BJJ or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by stymie [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
I agree with everything you wrote here. The "old fashioned" wrestling is much more erotic. Often the bjj submissions are extremely subtle, and sometimes you don't even realize someone has been tapped right away. But so many videos have size and strength mismatches in favor of the guys, I welcome the ladies having more knowledge of bjj.
DWW-style wrestling looks more primal and natural, especially if neither of the two have any combat sports training. It's more passionate too. The more skilled opponents you involve the more tactical and calculated it becomes and less emotions are involved.

Don't get me wrong, I like videos if there is a skilled BJJ girl who can dominate a bigger stronger guy but it's not my favorite thing.

For me, the best setting will always be a naturally strong and athletic attractive girl with a great body against a boy her size, with neither of them having any real grappling training at all. Then they wrestle in some primal way to see who can overpower, dominate and subdue the opponent.

When I fantasized about girls fighting boys this is what I always had in mind and when I discovered DWW videos it was just what I wanted.

I understand the use of scissors because those submissions look erotic and humiliating, but my favorite have always been pins, particularly the grapevine pin. It's just such a dominant position, especially if it's a prolonged pin with the girl looking the defeated boy in the eyes. This is for me much more erotic than just tapping out to an armbar. It's normal to get caught in a submission by a skilled BJJ girl but if a non-trained girl has managed to put you in a grapevine pin and hold you down that means she just totally overpowered and conquered you and it's very erotic and humiliating.

Last edited by al89; 25-Jul-17 at 09:15.
Reply With Quote
  #102  
Old 25-Jul-17, 11:15
VCrakeV VCrakeV is offline
Member
Points: 10,055, Level: 43 Points: 10,055, Level: 43 Points: 10,055, Level: 43
Activity: 2.1% Activity: 2.1% Activity: 2.1%
Last Achievements
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Gender: Male
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Posts: 486
Thanks: 171
Thanked 254 Times in 135 Posts
Default Re: BJJ or not?

I'm not sure if I have a preference. I'm more into "fantasy" holds that you would not see in traditional wrestling or bjj, like foot smothers and chokes.
Reply With Quote
  #103  
Old 25-Jul-17, 11:30
al89 al89 is offline
Senior Member
Points: 5,775, Level: 32 Points: 5,775, Level: 32 Points: 5,775, Level: 32
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Gender: Male
Posts: 454
Thanks: 462
Thanked 1,259 Times in 314 Posts
Default Re: BJJ or not?

When it comes to smaller BJJ girl beating a bigger man while I like the concept it's not my favorite because I feel like it's more the BJJ that beat the guy rather than the girl. Obviously it's still her victory and she deserves respect for putting the years of work into improving her technique, but I feel like it's more of a demonstration of how sound and effective BJJ rather than a real fight.

Personally what I like the most are naturally strong and tall athletic girls who still look feminine and attractive, girls who just have amazing genetics and athletic attributes and can overpower random guys without having any sort of training but just by their raw athleticism and strenght.

The bigger and stronger guy losing to a BJJ girl could still theoretically start training BJJ and have a better chance next time, but a guy who is simply weaker than the incredibly athletic amazon can do nothing but be submissive to her and accept her complete superiority.

Let's face it, BJJ doesn't really attract the best female athletes out there. Many of them start it as a hobby relatively late. Personally I was always more attracted to female athletes from the more established female sports like volleyball, gymnastics, swimming, tennis or track and field. A lot of those girls are incredibly athletic and started training in those sports very early. I also love the feminine outfits the women get to wear in those sports.

When it comes to girls trained in combat sports I would prefer female freestyle wrestlers to BJJ girls.

That said, I'm not picky and I appreciate almost everything that is produced by this fetish industry, I'm happy that these things exist at all and I can get into most of it, I also like to explore new things all the time. I'm just saying what I like the most.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to al89 For This Useful Post:
  #104  
Old 25-Jul-17, 15:25
VCrakeV VCrakeV is offline
Member
Points: 10,055, Level: 43 Points: 10,055, Level: 43 Points: 10,055, Level: 43
Activity: 2.1% Activity: 2.1% Activity: 2.1%
Last Achievements
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Gender: Male
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Posts: 486
Thanks: 171
Thanked 254 Times in 135 Posts
Default Re: BJJ or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
When it comes to smaller BJJ girl beating a bigger man while I like the concept it's not my favorite because I feel like it's more the BJJ that beat the guy rather than the girl. Obviously it's still her victory and she deserves respect for putting the years of work into improving her technique, but I feel like it's more of a demonstration of how sound and effective BJJ rather than a real fight.

Personally what I like the most are naturally strong and tall athletic girls who still look feminine and attractive, girls who just have amazing genetics and athletic attributes and can overpower random guys without having any sort of training but just by their raw athleticism and strenght.

The bigger and stronger guy losing to a BJJ girl could still theoretically start training BJJ and have a better chance next time, but a guy who is simply weaker than the incredibly athletic amazon can do nothing but be submissive to her and accept her complete superiority.

Let's face it, BJJ doesn't really attract the best female athletes out there. Many of them start it as a hobby relatively late. Personally I was always more attracted to female athletes from the more established female sports like volleyball, gymnastics, swimming, tennis or track and field. A lot of those girls are incredibly athletic and started training in those sports very early. I also love the feminine outfits the women get to wear in those sports.

When it comes to girls trained in combat sports I would prefer female freestyle wrestlers to BJJ girls.

That said, I'm not picky and I appreciate almost everything that is produced by this fetish industry, I'm happy that these things exist at all and I can get into most of it, I also like to explore new things all the time. I'm just saying what I like the most.
Totally agree on that first paragraph. If she is hot - hell, if she isn't unattractive - I'd be interested in at least checking a video out. I'd also wrestle a variety of girls. I have my preferences, but I'll take what I can get: smaller girls, bigger girls (bigger than me - I'll admit, I'm not interested in amazons, bodybuilders, and overweight women), bjj girls, wrestlers, athletes, couch potatoes, you name it.

Personally, I prefer the unrealistic, famtasy scenarios (smaller, untrained girl dominates), though I also like a slightly larger woman dominating.
Reply With Quote
  #105  
Old 25-Jul-17, 19:29
Njordin's Avatar
Njordin Njordin is offline
Member
Points: 12,984, Level: 49 Points: 12,984, Level: 49 Points: 12,984, Level: 49
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Last Achievements
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 209
Thanks: 452
Thanked 1,703 Times in 116 Posts
Default Re: BJJ or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Let's face it, BJJ doesn't really attract the best female athletes out there.
I really don't know what this means.

Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Many of them start it as a hobby relatively late.
That's because this sport is very new and kids classes are not well established yet. It will probably be the complete opposite in 20 years from now. But has this to do with out subject ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Personally what I like the most are naturally strong and tall athletic girls who still look feminine and attractive, girls who just have amazing genetics and athletic attributes and can overpower random guys without having any sort of training but just by their raw athleticism and strenght.
No such a thing. It's extremely hard to find a woman who does no sport, who just sits on a chair the whole day and is just naturally so strong that she can beat some (weak) men. Unless you fantasize about a woman who has amazing genetics (sic) AND does some sport. But in this case, why wouldn't you attribute her win to the sport she practices, just like you'd do with a bjj woman ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
When it comes to smaller BJJ girl beating a bigger man while I like the concept it's not my favorite because I feel like it's more the BJJ that beat the guy rather than the girl.
Don't worry, you can have a bigger bjj girl tear to pieces a smaller and weaker untrained male alright. Not all bjj girls have to be 50 kg.

Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
The bigger and stronger guy losing to a BJJ girl could still theoretically start training BJJ and have a better chance next time, but a guy who is simply weaker than the incredibly athletic amazon can do nothing but be submissive to her and accept her complete superiority.
This one is by far my biggest objection.
Really ? Care to explain, then, how the smaller and weaker girl manages to defeat the bigger and stronger guy with her bjj training ? So, a small woman can beat a strong man at wrestling if she trains properly, but a weak man can't do the same with a stronger woman ? I am sorry but what your described above is you fantasy. You are entitled to it, but it's just fantasy. The weak males you've seen in videos, who have lost to big and strong females, could and would have done far better if they had been trained properly.

I don't mean to disagree with your taste in competitive mixed wrestling. Your taste is your taste, but you said a couple of things that I couldn't have left unanswered.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Njordin For This Useful Post:
  #106  
Old 25-Jul-17, 20:56
al89 al89 is offline
Senior Member
Points: 5,775, Level: 32 Points: 5,775, Level: 32 Points: 5,775, Level: 32
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Gender: Male
Posts: 454
Thanks: 462
Thanked 1,259 Times in 314 Posts
Default Re: BJJ or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Njordin [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
I really don't know what this means.
You should chill out a bit instead of aggressively attacking me because of just describing my personal taste. The way you posted this is really ridiculous.

To clear it up, BJJ is not a sport where a gifted athlete would like to go. There is no money in it and the infrastructure isn't developed enough. Most athletic girls I know who started participating in sports young went to sports like swimming, handball, volleyball, track and field etc. This is what I like and if you don't I honestly couldn't care less, why do you assume I want to debate these things with you?

Quote:
That's because this sport is very new and kids classes are not well established yet. It will probably be the complete opposite in 20 years from now. But has this to do with out subject ?
If you weren't dissecting my post you might have seen the larger context and the point I was trying to make.

Quote:
No such a thing. It's extremely hard to find a woman who does no sport, who just sits on a chair the whole day and is just naturally so strong that she can beat some (weak) men. Unless you fantasize about a woman who has amazing genetics (sic) AND does some sport. But in this case, why wouldn't you attribute her win to the sport she practices, just like you'd do with a bjj woman ?
I said athletic which assumes that she is involved with sport activities. Maybe you should read better and more carefully if you already decide to quote my post sentence by sentence which is always an ignorant thing to do since it ignores the wider context.

And no, I wouldn't attribute her victory to the sport she practices because she wouldn't be using techniques from that sport but just her general athleticism.

Quote:
Don't worry, you can have a bigger bjj girl tear to pieces a smaller and weaker untrained male alright. Not all bjj girls have to be 50 kg.
I was specifically making a point about the instances where a smaller BJJ girl defeats a larger male since a lot of people brought up the point of BJJ being good because smaller women can beat larger men. Which I agree with it but I just like the DWW-style wrestling for the reasons I listed. I'm sorry that you're so dense that I have to explain this to you in details. In fact I would sorry for you if you weren't so aggressive and confrontational for no reason whatsoever.

Quote:
This one is by far my biggest objection.
Really ? Care to explain, then, how the smaller and weaker girl manages to defeat the bigger and stronger guy with her bjj training ? So, a small woman can beat a strong man at wrestling if she trains properly, but a weak man can't do the same with a stronger woman ? I am sorry but what your described above is you fantasy. You are entitled to it, but it's just fantasy. The weak males you've seen in videos, who have lost to big and strong females, could and would have done far better if they had been trained properly.
If neither of them have any training it means that all things are being equal. As soon as you start adding complex techniques and advanced training then it's only a matter of who is more experienced in what is essentially a sport. Matching up two people not trained in complex technical combat sports is much more primal and it's where athleticism and strenght play a bigger part.

Last edited by al89; 25-Jul-17 at 21:03.
Reply With Quote
  #107  
Old 25-Jul-17, 21:39
Njordin's Avatar
Njordin Njordin is offline
Member
Points: 12,984, Level: 49 Points: 12,984, Level: 49 Points: 12,984, Level: 49
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Last Achievements
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 209
Thanks: 452
Thanked 1,703 Times in 116 Posts
Default Re: BJJ or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Most athletic girls I know who started participating in sports young went to sports like swimming, handball, volleyball, track and field etc.
Yeah, yeah, you could have added judo as well in the list. The difference of those with bjj is that they are old and well established sports. Every parent knows swimming. Who the hell (outside brazil and USA) knows bjj ? This is the reason. It doesn't require too much brain to understand this. Outside the U.S sports like swimming and track and field give no money either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
And no, I wouldn't attribute her victory to the sport she practices because she wouldn't be using techniques from that sport but just her general athleticism.
So, her general athleticism would not come from the sport she practices for years ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
If neither of them have any training it means that all things are being equal
No, no. No equal things here. You didn't refer anything about equal opponents in your previous post. You agreed that a small girl can beat a bigger guy if she has the technical knowledge. Then, you clearly wrote that a small guy can't do anything but be submissive to the amazon (sic). If you can't see the contradiction here, or the double standards that you're using, there's nothing I can do to help you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
You should chill out a bit instead of aggressively attacking
Quote:
Originally Posted by al89 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
if you weren't so aggressive and confrontational for no reason whatsoever.
I don't know, grow a thicker skin maybe and stop being so excessively sensitive ? There was no aggression from my side. There was only excessive sensitivity from yours.
Reply With Quote
  #108  
Old 25-Jul-17, 22:16
al89 al89 is offline
Senior Member
Points: 5,775, Level: 32 Points: 5,775, Level: 32 Points: 5,775, Level: 32
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Gender: Male
Posts: 454
Thanks: 462
Thanked 1,259 Times in 314 Posts
Default Re: BJJ or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Njordin [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Yeah, yeah, you could have added judo as well in the list. The difference of those with bjj is that they are old and well established sports. Every parent knows swimming. Who the hell (outside brazil and USA) knows bjj ? This is the reason. It doesn't require too much brain to understand this. Outside the U.S sports like swimming and track and field give no money either.
We are not discussing about why it is so but about the fact that it is so. I was never claiming that BJJ is an "old and well established sport" so what is the point of your claims here since they don't necessarily contradict with mine? You can't even follow the course of the debate.

Quote:
So, her general athleticism would not come from the sport she practices for years ?
Athleticism is a mixture of being involved in sports and genetic gifts. I never said that practicing a sport doesn't play a part so once again you're making ridiculous conclusions.

Quote:
No, no. No equal things here. You didn't refer anything about equal opponents in your previous post. You agreed that a small girl can beat a bigger guy if she has the technical knowledge. Then, you clearly wrote that a small guy can't do anything but be submissive to the amazon (sic). If you can't see the contradiction here, or the double standards that you're using, there's nothing I can do to help you.
In the same post I wrote without having any sort of training, which was obviously meant that neither of them have any training, ergo all things are being equal as far as training in fighting techniques goes (I didn't say "equal opponents" which is just another thing that you misinterpreted). Maybe you would have noticed that if you weren't quoting my post sentence by sentence like an idiot and ignoring the context. There is a post of mine just before the post you quoted which also gives some insight into what my thoughts are. Basically I see wrestling between two non-skilled opponents as a more primal thing, once you start adding elaborate techniques it becomes more of a sport-type of competition.

Quote:
I don't know, grow a thicker skin maybe and stop being so excessively sensitive ? There was no aggression from my side. There was only excessive sensitivity from yours.
You're the only one who is excessively sensitive since you reacted aggressively and became confrontational because of my post which was not even provocative or controversial in any way at all and was just about my personal taste. You exposed yourself as petty and ignorant since you totally misinterpreted or failed to understand most of what I wrote.

This has nothing to do with me, I only reacted to being confronted. Why do you assume I even care about you? You on the other hand care about me since you reacted to my personal taste.
Reply With Quote
  #109  
Old 25-Jul-17, 22:26
funwrestler funwrestler is offline
Member
Points: 20,860, Level: 63 Points: 20,860, Level: 63 Points: 20,860, Level: 63
Activity: 4.9% Activity: 4.9% Activity: 4.9%
Last Achievements
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Gender: Male
Location: World
Posts: 1,103
Thanks: 752
Thanked 1,288 Times in 454 Posts
Default Re: BJJ or not?

Njordin & Al89: thanks for keeping this forum alive and kicking my friends!
Have a good one.
Reply With Quote
  #110  
Old 26-Jul-17, 08:36
Naji's Avatar
Naji Naji is offline
Administrator
Points: 864,862, Level: 100 Points: 864,862, Level: 100 Points: 864,862, Level: 100
Activity: 61.9% Activity: 61.9% Activity: 61.9%
Last Achievements
Award-Showcase
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Gender: Male
Location: Prague
Posts: 14,286
Thanks: 12,797
Thanked 115,688 Times in 9,926 Posts
Default Re: BJJ or not?

Guys, this is going off-topic. As to the main subject, there is really nothing to argue about in this thread. It's all about personal preferences. Don't force your opinion onto others. Let's all agree to disagree peacefully.
__________________
[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] | [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] | [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] | [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] | [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] | [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] | [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Naji For This Useful Post:
Reply

Tags
bjj in mixed wrestling

Thread Tools
Display Modes



All times are GMT. The time now is 14:05.


Powered by vBulletin® - Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.