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  #11  
Old 01-Jul-18, 23:25
G-Force
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Default Re: Female BJJ Pros vs. Average Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClckwrkOra [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Why don’t you and your buds take a few jiu-jitsu lessons and test your theory?

If you’re right, you should easily defeat smaller females who have only six months of training.

Added after 6 minutes:


Nothing will end the debate, because some men want to believe that strength wins every fight.

They refuse to accept real-world evidence that might disprove their beliefs.

And they refuse to grapple or otherwise test their theories to see if they hold water.
I agree with this.
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  #12  
Old 02-Jul-18, 00:08
John3 John3 is offline
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Default Re: Female BJJ Pros vs. Average Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClckwrkOra [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Why don’t you and your buds take a few jiu-jitsu lessons and test your theory?

If you’re right, you should easily defeat smaller females who have only six months of training.

Added after 6 minutes:




Nothing will end the debate, because some men want to believe that strength wins every fight.

They refuse to accept real-world evidence that might disprove their beliefs.

And they refuse to grapple or otherwise test their theories to see if they hold water.
Yeah, ok. You know what? Just make few months of BJJ compulsory for every woman in the world. You would solve any issue related to rape or physical abuse, forever. Just 20-30 BJJ lessons and any problem would be solved, all the strenght and different size with any adversary suddenly gone. It might sound ridiculous for a man but they are females, right? They have superpowers! BJJ is the only martial art that transforms you in a killer, nobody would beat you in a ground fight unless he/she is more trained.
And it's quite easy! Everything in the world requires struggle and focus trough time but not this, with few classes you can beat the crap out of the 80% of people out there.

I know that it's a fetish forum but geez..
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  #13  
Old 02-Jul-18, 03:02
G-Force
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Default Re: Female BJJ Pros vs. Average Men

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Originally Posted by John3 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Yeah, ok. You know what? Just make few months of BJJ compulsory for every woman in the world. You would solve any issue related to rape or physical abuse, forever. Just 20-30 BJJ lessons and any problem would be solved, all the strenght and different size with any adversary suddenly gone. It might sound ridiculous for a man but they are females, right? They have superpowers! BJJ is the only martial art that transforms you in a killer, nobody would beat you in a ground fight unless he/she is more trained.
And it's quite easy! Everything in the world requires struggle and focus trough time but not this, with few classes you can beat the crap out of the 80% of people out there.

I know that it's a fetish forum but geez..
You are using a false dichotomy here, a classic logical fallacy. You are assuming there are only two outcomes, either the trained woman beats the average guy up ALL the time in ANY situation or she NEVER wins in ANY situation to the overpowering average male. You leave proven events, specific circumstances, and basic chaos completely out of the equation. Furthermore, your hyperbolic argument to disprove the effectiveness of BJJ is patently absurd. You assert that in order for it to pass the litmus test of truth, training all women in BJJ surely MUST be able to eradicate rape or physical abuse worldwide for it to be valid. Nobody said BJJ gave anyone, MAN OR WOMAN superpowers, invincibility, or made anyone able to "beat the crap out of the 80% of people out there". Also, altercations on the STREET are an entirely different circumstance for both men and women, martial artist or average joe. This forum is a fetish forum, and it indulges in the REALITY aspect just as much as the fantasy. The humorous part is, there are still guys on here that still have not embraced or accepted both.

Last edited by G-Force; 02-Jul-18 at 03:33.
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  #14  
Old 02-Jul-18, 04:09
Amazonia Amazonia is offline
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Default Re: Female BJJ Pros vs. Average Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Force [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
You are using a false dichotomy here, a classic logical fallacy. You are assuming there are only two outcomes, either the trained woman beats the average guy up ALL the time in ANY situation or she NEVER wins in ANY situation to the overpowering average male. You leave proven events, specific circumstances, and basic chaos completely out of the equation. Furthermore, your hyperbolic argument to disprove the effectiveness of BJJ is patently absurd. You assert that in order for it to pass the litmus test of truth, training all women in BJJ surely MUST be able to eradicate rape or physical abuse worldwide for it to be valid. Nobody said BJJ gave anyone, MAN OR WOMAN superpowers, invincibility, or made anyone able to "beat the crap out of the 80% of people out there". Also, altercations on the STREET are an entirely different circumstance for both men and women, martial artist or average joe. This forum is a fetish forum, and it indulges in the REALITY aspect just as much as the fantasy. The humorous part is, there are still guys on here that still have not embraced or accepted both.
He was just making fun out of some absurd statements. I think people are taking this too seriously. The debate is pretty absurd in itself, categories like "average man" are impossible to define, especially these days when men are totally different to each other. "Trained women" is another category that can't be defined. I honestly don't know why people obsess about it so much.

Look, pretty much everyone here knows that BJJ is effective but let's not get absurd here. You need to understand that BJJ has a weird cult following due to its aggressive marketing and it annoys a lot of people who otherwise respect submission grappling and are into BJJ themselves. You don't see that with other combat sports and it makes the BJJ community look insecure when some people act like they still need to issue out "Gracie challenges". For example you don't see boxing guys feeling the need to promote their sport by saying that some 130 pound girl who trained boxing for 6 months could KO any man who doesn't box. I think it's mostly because BJJ isn't as popular as MMA or boxing or even Judo and they have to make exaggerated statements to even get noticed. I love BJJ/submission grappling as part of MMA but I also understand why people like to make fun out of the stereotypical real life Renato Laranja types.

BJJ used to expose the unpractical and overhyped traditional martial arts talking about "death touches" and small skinny Asian martial artists who could beat up anybody. Everyone loves BJJ for that including myself. But it seems like more and more some people now want to promote BJJ as something that it used to fight against and people now have these ideas that size and strength don't matter again and that there are some "death touch" techniques that can overcome everything and what not. Reading some of the posts here you get a feeling that these people also believe that a female BJJ black belt could choke out a male lion because the lion doesn't know BJJ techniques, leverage, timing...

MMA proved that BJJ can be nullified by other combat sport techniques. It also proved that weight classes matter (guys almost killing themselves to have few pounds of weight advantage) and that strength and conditioning is an important part of fighting. Many of the top guys in MMA aren't even ranked in BJJ (they're technically "white belts") and the vast majority of them don't come from BJJ background. BJJ isn't the end-all of fighting and it never was. There are limits to every martial art and there are also limits to technique winning over strength.

Last edited by Amazonia; 02-Jul-18 at 04:14.
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Old 02-Jul-18, 04:52
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  #15  
Old 02-Jul-18, 09:39
John3 John3 is offline
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Default Re: Female BJJ Pros vs. Average Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amazonia [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
He was just making fun out of some absurd statements. I think people are taking this too seriously. The debate is pretty absurd in itself, categories like "average man" are impossible to define, especially these days when men are totally different to each other. "Trained women" is another category that can't be defined. I honestly don't know why people obsess about it so much.

Look, pretty much everyone here knows that BJJ is effective but let's not get absurd here. You need to understand that BJJ has a weird cult following due to its aggressive marketing and it annoys a lot of people who otherwise respect submission grappling and are into BJJ themselves. You don't see that with other combat sports and it makes the BJJ community look insecure when some people act like they still need to issue out "Gracie challenges". For example you don't see boxing guys feeling the need to promote their sport by saying that some 130 pound girl who trained boxing for 6 months could KO any man who doesn't box. I think it's mostly because BJJ isn't as popular as MMA or boxing or even Judo and they have to make exaggerated statements to even get noticed. I love BJJ/submission grappling as part of MMA but I also understand why people like to make fun out of the stereotypical real life Renato Laranja types.

BJJ used to expose the unpractical and overhyped traditional martial arts talking about "death touches" and small skinny Asian martial artists who could beat up anybody. Everyone loves BJJ for that including myself. But it seems like more and more some people now want to promote BJJ as something that it used to fight against and people now have these ideas that size and strength don't matter again and that there are some "death touch" techniques that can overcome everything and what not. Reading some of the posts here you get a feeling that these people also believe that a female BJJ black belt could choke out a male lion because the lion doesn't know BJJ techniques, leverage, timing...

MMA proved that BJJ can be nullified by other combat sport techniques. It also proved that weight classes matter (guys almost killing themselves to have few pounds of weight advantage) and that strength and conditioning is an important part of fighting. Many of the top guys in MMA aren't even ranked in BJJ (they're technically "white belts") and the vast majority of them don't come from BJJ background. BJJ isn't the end-all of fighting and it never was. There are limits to every martial art and there are also limits to technique winning over strength.
Thank you.
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  #16  
Old 02-Jul-18, 12:36
ClckwrkOra ClckwrkOra is offline
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Default Re: Female BJJ Pros vs. Average Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by John3 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Yeah, ok. You know what? Just make few months of BJJ compulsory for every woman in the world. You would solve any issue related to rape or physical abuse, forever. Just 20-30 BJJ lessons and any problem would be solved, all the strenght and different size with any adversary suddenly gone. It might sound ridiculous for a man but they are females, right? They have superpowers! BJJ is the only martial art that transforms you in a killer, nobody would beat you in a ground fight unless he/she is more trained.
And it's quite easy! Everything in the world requires struggle and focus trough time but not this, with few classes you can beat the crap out of the 80% of people out there.

I know that it's a fetish forum but geez..

You make factual claims, but you're unwilling to prove them in real life.

I wonder why.
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  #17  
Old 02-Jul-18, 12:57
ricky-8- ricky-8- is offline
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Default Re: Female BJJ Pros vs. Average Men

Some session girls (purple belts and higher) told me that they couldn't submit some untrained but strong guys in some sessions. One or two of them said that they lost to untrained men.

They also mentioned that they had sessions whith clients who have BJJ/Judo training.
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  #18  
Old 02-Jul-18, 15:25
ClckwrkOra ClckwrkOra is offline
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Default Re: Female BJJ Pros vs. Average Men

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Originally Posted by ricky-8- [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Some session girls (purple belts and higher) told me that they couldn't submit some untrained but strong guys in some sessions. One or two of them said that they lost to untrained men.

They also mentioned that they had sessions whith clients who have BJJ/Judo training.

I can’t speak to what people have told you or not.

Training in the right combat art simply increases one’s chances of winning.

Any human can beat anyone else. The question is who is more likely to prevail.
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  #19  
Old 02-Jul-18, 15:55
G-Force
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Default Re: Female BJJ Pros vs. Average Men

Again, and I'm repeating myself at the expense of belaboring a point that should be common sense. Nobody here is saying BJJ is some dark mystical art that gives it's practitioner 100% victory over a non-practioner. I completely understand that there has been a lot of hype generated by BJJ, some of it valid, and much of it just hype. That being said, every martial art has had it's period of hype, 60s Judo, 70s Kungfu, 80s Karate, etc. Doesn't mean those arts are useless anymore than boxing is useless just because it isn't as popular as the current hype of MMA. It's all about the fighter. And again, repeating myself, why are some here on this forum still operating over a false dichotomy? Yes, size, weight, aggression, and strength matter, giving anyone who possesses these traits instant advantage. And yes, men in general possess all these traits over women. But it's also true women can still overpower a man given the right situation, especially women with some kind of training whether it be BJJ or whatever. It doesn't happen all the time every time in every given scenario or situation, but it happens often enough to be considered a part of reality whether or not you want to accept it. And that is what makes it so AWESOME. It's the contradiction to the norm and mind blowing perplexity that the "delicate" femine gender can still come out victorious.

Last edited by G-Force; 02-Jul-18 at 16:15.
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  #20  
Old 02-Jul-18, 17:38
John3 John3 is offline
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Default Re: Female BJJ Pros vs. Average Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClckwrkOra [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
You make factual claims, but you're unwilling to prove them in real life.

I wonder why.
Since you are asking..I took 4 bjj lessons a couple of years ago, but during the forth I got injured and was forced off for 1 month (a very huge guy with little experience had compressed hard my neck). I was uncomfortable with my gym mates tough and never came back. I bump into one of them while I was recovering and he told me that they were still training for the basics (flip and..somersault I guess?). This was the second month. They grappled and he was improving slowly, like in everything in life. I did judo and Wing Chun when I was younger. According to my experience your skills develop gradually and in fighting sports they help you to fill the gap in power with your opponents. Stronger is your adversary, more technique is needed. So if your question is if I have ever tried to wrestle a girl with few months of grappling experience no I don't, but I honestly don't believe that a girl or a guy significantly smaller and weaker than me could beat me in a fight with 30 lessons training, I'm sorry man.
I agree with the last post of G-Force, we are here to celebrate unusual but possible situations, but beyond the fetish we must live in a real world and to act accordingly.
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