Hiding Your Interest of Mixed And Female Wrestling

[femalewrestlingchannel]

Originally Posted by enigma [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

I never accused you personally of being like me nor did I say every single person who liked mixed wrestling liked it for sexual reasons, I said most do and you know it. Now be honest, do you think most of the people who use this forum, buy mw videos, and pay for session wrestlers are more like you or more like me?

And thats why you started this thread in the first place right? Not to explain why you feel the need to tell everyone that you enjoy female wrestling but to ask the rest of us why we don't and the reason why is pretty clear. Bringing up the fact that you, or some other guy, or some of the women involved don't personally see it as sexual doesn't matter. You all can frame it however you want but if you want me and most others to honestly answer why we like it then we can only frame it one way.

If mw wasn't sexual for me I would never have put the sort of money into it that I have nor would I care about the gender of the people involved, I could just save money signing up for a bjj class or just watch actual competitions.
Thats why I'm generally wary of people who insist that they only like mw for fun, why does the gender matter to you then? Why spend such insane amounts of money on videos and sessions? Going back to the scenario you posed earlier, Bill would want to know why Jim insisted on wrestling Women specifically, and saying its "fun exercise" wouldn't be a sufficient answer because you could do that with other guys too. Saying that you aren't attracted to the women involved doesn't really mean much either because there are women I generally wouldn't find especially attractive that become more appealing when I'm watching them wrestling. Others here just enjoy the sexual humiliation they feel from women winning and don't care about the attractiveness at all. But if you're going to insist that none of this applies to you then fine, I'll take you at your word but you must know you're in the minority.

Moreover theres a big difference between taking something that people like and adding a sexy element to it and doing something primarily for that reason. People that like Pro Wrestling may enjoy seeing women in skimpy outfits get involved but they also come because they like the stories and because they genuinely enjoy wrestling regardless of gender. For me and many others we have little to no interest in wrestling outside of this fetish. And even for those who actually take bjj, that isn't the main reason why they'll pay a session wrestler 300 for an hour of her time.

Pat Patterson may be gay but that doesn't mean that he created and marketed WWF for gay men the way these mw videos are clearly created and marketed primary for sex reasons. Obviously theres some people somewhere who probably get off on WWE but they are not the main audience.

Well, first off you are describing my business strategy and why we have not went nude. It's also why we have not done overly fetish things, but certainly straddle the line.

We have done 79 Episodes now.

Not my finest work, but I'm wrapping this series up and have some really good ideas for what's next.

You might also notice I bought mats with our logos on it and fancy 7.5 foot high and 10 foot long dividers that cost me a very pretty penny. This is to do what WWE has done, which is slowly legitimize something that would otherwise be labeled a fetish.

This is why I'm curious as to the perceptions some of you have, as it's weird to have a business where it's own customers won't promote it for you, nor do the majority of ladies who work with us either generally.

Porn companies say we are not nude, mainstream companies think we are porn.

An interesting challenge to say the least.

Why does gender matter to me you ask?

Because I'm not gay. I have no interest in men, nor do I really like men touching me generally. I'm not homophobic, I have wrestled with a guy or two in front of the ladies just to show I would do it, but it's not my cup of tea nor will it ever be.

And, as an older experienced man I know my female target market quite well sexually. Thus, I have little interest in most, as what I like/look for is specific and precise.

I am in the minority, no question.

Of course, your point is that the majority of people have a sexual interest in it.

You ask, are they more like you or me?

Well, the answer is neither. The sexual variance (variety) among men is quite incredible. When it comes to wrestling, I have as many labels as I can to try to keep track of this stuff, but it's quite daunting.

And, there is more evidence to this issue as well, but I don't want to call out specific customers and their habits on this, because even speaking generally would signal to them I was speaking of them.

Despite all of this, I can say is I truly understand where you are coming from and I appreciate you taking time out of your day to discuss this issue with myself and everyone reading.

However.

My advice (still) to anyone reading is that you have nothing to hide and there is nothing wrong with female vs female wrestling or mixed wrestling.

Truly, not a damn thing.

You should feel no shame. And, I think you will find life is more pleasing when you "own it" and make no apologies for something you love, that harms no one, that brings nothing but smiling faces on both sides.

[mixedwrestler08]

Just my 2 cents for the guys who hate feminism so much. I guess there is no single definition whats actually feminism is. And one lady who consider herself feminist might have much different views and believes then somer other feminist lady.

I think it is completely fair and right that females have the same rights and chances as males. so anything from voting, equal pay, having the same rights in a marriage as the man, and so on. females who fought for this have my deepest respect. and without these girls, there probably would be no singular strong and independent female session wrestler, the gilrs we love.

femisist who hates man, hates sexuality or think there is no differences between men and women..that are "the feminists" or radicals I do not like as well. and probably most females do not share their views.

[femalewrestlingchannel]

Originally Posted by mixedwrestler08 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

Just my 2 cents for the guys who hate feminism so much. I guess there is no single definition whats actually feminism is. And one lady who consider herself feminist might have much different views and believes then somer other feminist lady.

I think it is completely fair and right that females have the same rights and chances as males. so anything from voting, equal pay, having the same rights in a marriage as the man, and so on. females who fought for this have my deepest respect. and without these girls, there probably would be no singular strong and independent female session wrestler, the gilrs we love.

femisist who hates man, hates sexuality or think there is no differences between men and women..that are "the feminists" or radicals I do not like as well. and probably most females do not share their views.

Most women you talk to in the real world, not on TV or on your daily talk radio:

- generally say that feminists are crazy, angry, or don't make sense.

- notice that feminists searching for equality and representation want to be "part" of the bigger group, but rarely lead the group.

- notice that women on TV are yelling about men raping and oppressing women, but normal women can't tell you many instances where they see it often at all.

- understand that modern day feminists don't represent what feminism was supposed to be all about, which was sexual independence.

- realize that most "girl power" shows get cancelled. The only recent success I can think of among a LONG list of failures I believe was Wonder Woman.

We know this from our company. The overall market is not much interested in "girl power".

Not at all.

And the biggest reason.........

Women hate women.

Don't believe me? Try starting your own women's wrestling company! lol

[mixedwrestler08]

radikal feminism is just one part of feminism. you can not use them both interchangeable. if you mean the sub group of radical feminist I completely agree with you.

do not me too for example shows that there is still oppression and sexual abuse going on. you prbaly right that it des not ocuur that often in normal life like tv shows suggest. it might have declined in the last decades as well. but still it is a problem.

[enigma]

Originally Posted by femalewrestlingchannel [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

Well, first off you are describing my business strategy and why we have not went nude. It's also why we have not done overly fetish things, but certainly straddle the line.

No, I was talking about why this industry exists and how the way its marketed clearly reflects the motivations behind it. But I've glanced at your site and we clearly have different ideas about what is overly fetish.

Originally Posted by femalewrestlingchannel [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

You might also notice I bought mats with our logos on it and fancy 7.5 foot high and 10 foot long dividers that cost me a very pretty penny. This is to do what WWE has done, which is slowly legitimize something that would otherwise be labeled a fetish.

The idea that the WWE would otherwise be labeled a fetish if not for the money behind it is completely ahistorical. Wrestling was not seen by the public as some kinky thing that slowly needed to be legitimized, it was a popular sport and WWE just happened to be the most successful at promoting it. The subset of mixed and female wrestling was created for the small niche of people who are turned on by such things. Some fancy mats and dividers isn't going to change that.

Originally Posted by femalewrestlingchannel [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

Why does gender matter to me you ask?

Because I'm not gay. I have no interest in men, nor do I really like men touching me generally. I'm not homophobic, I have wrestled with a guy or two in front of the ladies just to show I would do it, but it's not my cup of tea nor will it ever be.

I mean this kind of proves my point. I knew guys who were truly into mixed marital arts, none of them were gay and yet they had no issue with grappling with other men because it was truly just a fun thing for them and not something sexual. If you were truly into wrestling for fun then the question of whether or not you're into men would be irrelevant because thats not what its about. Unless you're going to argue that simply touching another man is somehow gay to you (try telling that to UFC fighters) then you seem to be admitting that there is some sexual element in it for you otherwise you wouldn't perceive it as being gay.

Originally Posted by femalewrestlingchannel [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

This is why I'm curious as to the perceptions some of you have, as it's weird to have a business where it's own customers won't promote it for you, nor do the majority of ladies who work with us either generally.

Ah, so thats what this whole thing is about. You want more of your customers to promote your work. Understandable but I cant say I like how you've gone about it or the way you've needlessly insulted everyone here ("you're feminized"). Personal attacks to make people promote your work doesnt strike me as the best strategy.

Originally Posted by femalewrestlingchannel [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

You ask, are they more like you or me?

Well, the answer is neither. The sexual variance (variety) among men is quite incredible. When it comes to wrestling, I have as many labels as I can to try to keep track of this stuff, but it's quite daunting.

I meant are they more like you are me in terms of their motivations. Obviously no one is exactly like either of us and within this forum there are many reasons as to exactly what we find sexy about it but I think most would agree (as you just did earlier in your post) that their main motivations are sexual and not just "fun and exercise" as you said earlier.

Originally Posted by femalewrestlingchannel [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

My advice (still) to anyone reading is that you have nothing to hide and there is nothing wrong with female vs female wrestling or mixed wrestling.

Truly, not a damn thing.

You should feel no shame. And, I think you will find life is more pleasing when you "own it" and make no apologies for something you love, that harms no one, that brings nothing but smiling faces on both sides.

I mean this advice ignores almost everything thats been said in this thread. But you've told us now what your motivations were in starting this thread so I dont see any point in saying anything more.

[wgonzo64]

I hid my fantasy from my best friend for years in fear she would think I'm weird only to find out she is into it . story in interesting development

[femalewrestlingchannel]

Originally Posted by enigma [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

No, I was talking about why this industry exists and how the way its marketed clearly reflects the motivations behind it. But I've glanced at your site and we clearly have different ideas about what is overly fetish.

The idea that the WWE would otherwise be labeled a fetish if not for the money behind it is completely ahistorical. Wrestling was not seen by the public as some kinky thing that slowly needed to be legitimized, it was a popular sport and WWE just happened to be the most successful at promoting it. The subset of mixed and female wrestling was created for the small niche of people who are turned on by such things. Some fancy mats and dividers isn't going to change that.


I mean this kind of proves my point. I knew guys who were truly into mixed marital arts, none of them were gay and yet they had no issue with grappling with other men because it was truly just a fun thing for them and not something sexual. If you were truly into wrestling for fun then the question of whether or not you're into men would be irrelevant because thats not what its about. Unless you're going to argue that simply touching another man is somehow gay to you (try telling that to UFC fighters) then you seem to be admitting that there is some sexual element in it for you otherwise you wouldn't perceive it as being gay.

Ah, so thats what this whole thing is about. You want more of your customers to promote your work. Understandable but I cant say I like how you've gone about it or the way you've needlessly insulted everyone here ("you're feminized"). Personal attacks to make people promote your work doesnt strike me as the best strategy.


I meant are they more like you are me in terms of their motivations. Obviously no one is exactly like either of us and within this forum there are many reasons as to exactly what we find sexy about it but I think most would agree (as you just did earlier in your post) that their main motivations are sexual and not just "fun and exercise" as you said earlier.

I mean this advice ignores almost everything thats been said in this thread. But you've told us now what your motivations were in starting this thread so I dont see any point in saying anything more.

WWE is a sport? That's news to me.

And, you don't know the motivations of how things got started. Many things are born out of weird interests or motivations.

I guess we all struggle with the twisting definitions at times. And, you are simply wrong about the guy/girl thing. If I was learning MMA or Martial Arts I would have no problem grappling around with a guy.

For me, it would be because I wanted to learn something, not because I enjoyed it. I generally don't like guys touching me. If you do, maybe you can put an ad up on something like Meetfighters and have it. Have fun!

(I'm obviously kidding, you are seemingly into mixed)

With women, I tend to enjoy it more because it's a totally different thing. You usually don't have guys giggle when you wrestle you, or there is just little things I do with the women I wouldn't do with the guys, like a slight hairpull at times or maybe a tickle.

Again, it's not sexual for me, just fun.

As for your other arguments, any business owner would like their fans to re-share or recommend their work. If you are in business like you say you are, your company would like your customers to do the same thing.

Greatly lowers advertising/marketing costs.

In this business, it's a bit harder because people hide their interest of it. They don't talk about it with anyone, don't share it with anyone.

Defining what is porn is tricky, but if it is, so what? (is cheerleading porn?)

Sports + Sexy is the marketing. It will work, but it's going to take a while.

Of course I have a business interest, but I have a personal interest in seeing more guys quit hiding all of this as they I have seen a lot of relationships needlessly crumble and I lot of these guys have become my good friends.

Yes, my business strategy is just to be myself and talk tough to GUYS if needed. There are a ton of bullshitters, con-artists, liars, and if that's your cup of tea feel free.

Customers who deal with me know they are going to not only receive quality and value, but I have proven over and over again that I'm going to be straight with them, even especially when things are not rosy and sunshiny.

Try subscribing to our newsletter if you don't believe me:
[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

The type of guys I like to do business with (yes, I choose too and reject way more than I take) don't mind it at all, they can handle it and they tend to be my best customers.

They want me to be straight with them about where their money is going and that's what I do. If I miss anything, I correct it and over-deliver. It happens at times, but not often.

So, I don't need your advice on business. I'm doing just fine.

The primary thing people want to see is more women and more matches. Or, more opportunities to meet the ladies or maybe wrestle them in some type of mixed.

Most of them don't care about me bloviating on a message board. I'm simply doing this for my own market research, understanding, and also to get a few of you thinking about this, which was obviously achieved.

[mmadomination]

Wow Ringo's passive-aggressive tone, and obvious trolling are abhorrent. Hey anything for site clicks right? I've found pretty much everything he has said utterly insulting as a guy who has both done sessions and produced videos. It has no business being discussed in a vanilla place of business, not to mention it's just not the wisest decision to tell coworkers about it. As most aren't gonna buy you aren't paying the women for sex. Not to mention the cutthroat mentality of people saying anything to get the promotion over you. "Don't promote the wrestling weirdo" As for Wife/GF the pay is gonna be another issue, "Sorry honey no new car this year I spent my tax return on mixed wrestling sessions". Probably not gonna go over well. I'd say newsflash but it isn't really news that guys buy your videos to jack off to. I'm sure some like a storyline, but at the end of the day it's for masturbation purposes. Open a clips4sale store instead of trying to start a flame war spamming the forum with your link. I mean why would I hire a name wrestler like Ariel X and not take advantage of their traffic and search features? Makes no sense. Also your chauvinistic views on feminism and the way you speak of women not only don't fit on this topic, they are just antiquated.

[femalewrestlingchannel]

Originally Posted by mmadomination [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

Wow Ringo's passive-aggressive tone, and obvious trolling are abhorrent. Hey anything for site clicks right? I've found pretty much everything he has said utterly insulting as a guy who has both done sessions and produced videos. It has no business being discussed in a vanilla place of business, not to mention it's just not the wisest decision to tell coworkers about it. As most aren't gonna buy you aren't paying the women for sex. Not to mention the cutthroat mentality of people saying anything to get the promotion over you. "Don't promote the wrestling weirdo" As for Wife/GF the pay is gonna be another issue, "Sorry honey no new car this year I spent my tax return on mixed wrestling sessions". Probably not gonna go over well. I'd say newsflash but it isn't really news that guys buy your videos to jack off to. I'm sure some like a storyline, but at the end of the day it's for masturbation purposes. Open a clips4sale store instead of trying to start a flame war spamming the forum with your link. I mean why would I hire a name wrestler like Ariel X and not take advantage of their traffic and search features? Makes no sense. Also your chauvinistic views on feminism and the way you speak of women not only don't fit on this topic, they are just antiquated.

We will never work together and we were never going to work together anyway.

If you are advocating to your customers lying to their wives, that's on you.

This forum accounts for a very small percentage of my traffic and I rarely post here. As for the rest of what you said, I really don't understand any of it.

My only point was that there are some guys who actually end up enjoying this for aspects beyond just the sexual interest.

A better way I should have framed this topic when I started was:

Why do you lie about this to your Wives and Girlfriends?

I've not once advocated in this thread screaming it to the rooftops, but I have advocated owning it instead of shying away from it.

[james]

It must be great to have the balls/personality to be completely open about your fetish. I mentioned earlier in this thread that when I was in University I shared a house with a guy who loved facesitting and was completely open about it (while I kept my mouth shut). Also, our Landlord who owned the house and lived on the ground floor was massively into spanking (ie, him spanking girls). He spoke about this a lot, he used to tease his girlfriend that her ass wasn't very good for spanking (she was very slim), he had a massive collection of spanking magazines (this was pre internet). I always remember his girlfriend had a Greek (girl) friend come over and stay (this was in London), he couldn't help go on to his girlfriend and the Greek friend how much he'd like to smack her but!