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  #11  
Old 23-Feb-20, 22:20
boyofwinter boyofwinter is online now
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Default Re: a girl just wona state titel against the boys! no guy in the whole state could be

On one hand it's noteworthy, meaning there's been no shortage of boys to win that title in the past, good for her. On the other hand, it's a fact that the great majority of guys in high school are much bigger, so imagine a flyweight female winning a title in a state that large. Now that would be amazing.
Also note the 1A title, which usually means students from smaller schools/districts.

Last edited by boyofwinter; 23-Feb-20 at 22:29.
  #12  
Old 23-Feb-20, 22:31
Mixtor42 Mixtor42 is offline
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Default Re: a girl just wona state titel against the boys! no guy in the whole state could be

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Originally Posted by pepembo [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
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it's kinda crazy to think no guy in the whole state of north carolina is strong or skilled enough to defeat this cute girl
To be fair, no guy from a 1A school at 106 pounds could beat her. To be more fair, the previous year there were only 2 guys from a 1A school at 106 pounds who finished higher than her and she went 50-5 ([Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register])

I'm kind of surprised that it's taken this long. Three are a lot of physical advantages that men have, but being larger and more muscular is a huge portion of it. The weight categories in wrestling largely neutralize this. Add to the fact that it generally takes into a man's early 20s to realize his full strength and the high school athletes are in the 14-17 range and it seems like there is a solid window for an equal sized girl to compete with the boys. And the best of those ladies will win a lot.
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  #13  
Old 23-Feb-20, 22:38
mermao mermao is offline
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Default Re: a girl just wona state titel against the boys! no guy in the whole state could be

There are some young high school (and middle school) lady wrestlers at my MMA gym and the catch wrestling skills of some of them are awesome, but they are very small. We also have young small guys who are very skilled and strong. Texas has so many young lady wrestlers that they don't have to have mixed high school tourneys and to my knowledge they don't. At the gym, we all practice against each other with instructions to go easy and avoid injuring opponents. Easier said than done - we still have occasional injuries but nothing catastrophic during the time I've been there.
  #14  
Old 24-Feb-20, 01:15
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Default Re: a girl just wona state titel against the boys! no guy in the whole state could be

LOL at the same old cringey, insecure, butthurt comments from the same old posters.



Some perspective is fine. Sure, she's small and she wouldn't be able to beat guys in higher weight classes. Feel better now? Funny how we don't denigrate guys like Mayweather and McGregor and Nurmagomedov - the biggest draws in combat sports for not being the biggest and 'best overall' but merely champions in their own weight classes.

Not every guy is Brock Lesnar or Brain Shaw. Not every girl is a pixie. There's huge disparity between and amongst genders.
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Old 24-Feb-20, 02:12
pepembo pepembo is offline
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Default Re: a girl just wona state titel against the boys! no guy in the whole state could be

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wow! another girl won a state title today, two girl won against all the boys in two different states, this time arkansas, which already had a girl state champion a couple years ago
at the A4 i the 120 lbs a heavier division than heaven fitch who wrestled at 106 at A1
dude girls are killing it, stealing state titles from guys all the time now!
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  #16  
Old 24-Feb-20, 03:24
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WrestlerSingletPin WrestlerSingletPin is offline
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Default Re: a girl just wona state titel against the boys! no guy in the whole state could be

Who cares if it is 106 weight class. She became a state champ vs boys. She must be an amazing wrestler to overcome the physical disadvantage of facing boys, however, she makes up for that in her superior wrestling ability.
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  #17  
Old 24-Feb-20, 03:48
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Default Re: a girl just wona state titel against the boys! no guy in the whole state could be

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mixtor42 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Every single time. And it's disgusting that she'd be subjected to such a disgraceful failure of sportsmanship.

Can anyone clarify this? I can't seem to find the information online. Did she actually defeat male opponents to win the title, or did the boys opt-out each time?
  #18  
Old 24-Feb-20, 04:08
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Default Re: a girl just wona state titel against the boys! no guy in the whole state could be

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mixtor42 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Every single time. And it's disgusting that she'd be subjected to such a disgraceful failure of sportsmanship.



It's that foolish, shortsighted, and ultimately destructive behavior of abusing boys in this manner that needs to change. The idea that we should prevent our daughters from doing things because boys may get mistreated is simply answering one set of abuse with another set of abuse.
Refusing to compete is not a good position to take in my opinion. Competing and getting your ass kicked or losing, however, you gave it all you got and lost it much better in my opinion. I wrestled in matches when I was sick, vs. girls, injured, ect.. they where far from my best wrestling matches, however, I gave it what I got and lost or edged out result barely in my favor.

Added after 8 minutes:

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerCrushes [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Fuck that shit, man - there's no "however". If you're not able to compete on a given day, because you were sick or injured or because Aunt Jenny died and your mom is making you go to the funeral, that's too fucking bad. It sucks that you weren't able to compete, but in an individual competition, your absence doesn't diminish the accomplishments of those who got there.

This athlete beat the opponents in her bracket and won the medal. That's the way it works.
Totaly agree. Why I love to compete in wrestling. Everyone has situations in their life that suck but in a match you can put it aside and wrestle to win and give it your all

Quote:
Originally Posted by pepembo [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
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it's kinda crazy to think no guy in the whole state of north carolina is strong or skilled enough to defeat this cute girl
Good for her, great wrestler.

Last edited by WrestlerSingletPin; 24-Feb-20 at 04:06.
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  #19  
Old 24-Feb-20, 04:20
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InTheFlesh86 InTheFlesh86 is offline
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Default Re: a girl just wona state titel against the boys! no guy in the whole state could be

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mixtor42 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
I'm kind of surprised that it's taken this long. Three are a lot of physical advantages that men have, but being larger and more muscular is a huge portion of it. The weight categories in wrestling largely neutralize this. Add to the fact that it generally takes into a man's early 20s to realize his full strength and the high school athletes are in the 14-17 range and it seems like there is a solid window for an equal sized girl to compete with the boys. And the best of those ladies will win a lot.
Comments like yours and the one I'm about to make will inevitably be perceived by some as defensiveness, but I still think they're interesting to discuss. It seems to me that it would actually be possible to arbitrarily set a weight class such that due to the natural size differences between men and women, it significantly reduces the population of eligible male contenders while maximizing eligible female contenders and thus increasing the probability that the female will be of higher skill.

For example, it might be the case that at this age range, 106lbs constitutes the 90th percentile for females and only the 60th percentile for males. So it might not be surprising to find that the best one out of 10,000 females outperforms the best out of 6,000 males, or whatever the numbers may be.

Another thing to consider is that while 106lbs might be closer to the 'average' female size, it is likely 'below average' for a male. While this doesn't mean that an inter-gender match at this weight class is unfair, it does somewhat lessen the force of the "girl beats boy" narrative, as the most relevant distinction between the sexes (e.g. physical size) is being controlled for.
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  #20  
Old 24-Feb-20, 08:35
Mixtor42 Mixtor42 is offline
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Default Re: a girl just wona state titel against the boys! no guy in the whole state could be

Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheFlesh86 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Can anyone clarify this? I can't seem to find the information online. Did she actually defeat male opponents to win the title, or did the boys opt-out each time?
She defeated the boys to win the state title. Here's a picture from a local newspaper: [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

and here's the tournament bracket: [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

She won her first matches by pinfall, 9-4, and 11-3.

Added after 12 minutes:

Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheFlesh86 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Comments like yours and the one I'm about to make will inevitably be perceived by some as defensiveness, but I still think they're interesting to discuss. It seems to me that it would actually be possible to arbitrarily set a weight class such that due to the natural size differences between men and women, it significantly reduces the population of eligible male contenders while maximizing eligible female contenders and thus increasing the probability that the female will be of higher skill.

For example, it might be the case that at this age range, 106lbs constitutes the 90th percentile for females and only the 60th percentile for males. So it might not be surprising to find that the best one out of 10,000 females outperforms the best out of 6,000 males, or whatever the numbers may be.

Another thing to consider is that while 106lbs might be closer to the 'average' female size, it is likely 'below average' for a male. While this doesn't mean that an inter-gender match at this weight class is unfair, it does somewhat lessen the force of the "girl beats boy" narrative, as the most relevant distinction between the sexes (e.g. physical size) is being controlled for.
I agree that the size controls in wrestling have interesting effects such as helping to equalize girls and boys and - oddly enough - giving an upper body strength advantage to amputees that can overcome the lack of leverage that legs give.

However, I find it more important to do away with the "girl beats boy" narrative entirely. That narrative should not be some kind of bedrock that forces us to change other behaviors in order to accommodate. Rather the "girl beats boy" narrative is the behavior that we all need to change in order to be able to treat each other with respect.

Last edited by Mixtor42; 24-Feb-20 at 08:35.
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