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  #1  
Old 29-Apr-21, 23:00
Elbow Escape Elbow Escape is offline
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Default Who is the weakest untrained man that could beat Valentina Shevchenko?

That's a fun discussion I tought about, in your opinion who is the weakest man without any martial arts or combat sport training that could realiably beat Valentina Shevchenko, one of the best female fighter on the planet, in a fight?

The point is too see what you believe is the bare minimun requirement as far as size, strenght, speed, athletic ability etc...needed to beat her despite not having any technique or figthing training.

You can either answer a specific person (eg. for example "Lebron James" or "Arnold Schwarzenegger" or "Lionel Messi" or whatever) or you can put it in general terms to describe the kind of man you think would be enough to win, eg. "a top nfl player" or "a 6'0 200 lbs experienced weightlifter of average or even below average athleticism" or "an average man who has been into a bunch of street fights" or whatever your opinion is.

With "reliably beat" I mean that Valentina would have no chance of winning barring maybe an extremely lucky and unlikely fluke.
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Old 03-May-21, 11:57
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jiminy jiminy is offline
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Default Re: Who is the weakest untrained man that could beat Valentina Shevchenko?

With no MA or CS training, I think you'd have to look at pro athletes that are bigger, stronger and more athletic - i.e. elite men from Rugby, Basketball, etc.

It's an awkward question because there are a lot of unknowns. Maybe she could still utilise some BJJ and submission grappling tricks on a completely cold and uninitiated opponent.

99.9+% would have no chance.
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Old 03-May-21, 13:41
Elbow Escape Elbow Escape is offline
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Default Re: Who is the weakest untrained man that could beat Valentina Shevchenko?

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Originally Posted by jiminy [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
With no MA or CS training, I think you'd have to look at pro athletes that are bigger, stronger and more athletic - i.e. elite men from Rugby, Basketball, etc.

It's an awkward question because there are a lot of unknowns. Maybe she could still utilise some BJJ and submission grappling tricks on a completely cold and uninitiated opponent.

99.9+% would have no chance.

I tend to agree with you, I believe that big and strong elite men from rugby, basketball, football etc...vs her would be an uncertain match-up that could go either way.
They have a very good chance of overwhelming her on physicality alone, but they still could lose if they are caught by surpise by something like a sneaky back take, an armbar or an heel hook from a position they mistakenly believe is safe.
(for example someone without training is very unlikely to assume that being on top of a woman less than half his size can be an extremely dangerous spot to be in)

In my opinion to be sure she has no chance you would need elite heavyweight weighlifters and strongmen, men that are are like 350-400 lbs of muscle and can lift near half a ton while still being athletic and mobile.
At that point they would be so big and strong that they could literally walk through everything she does without being fazed even if they don't understand what is happening, and they would probably be able to literally crush her just by applying pressure with their bodies.

On the other hand guys who are not at least 200 lbs professional athletes would have no chance.
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Old 04-May-21, 23:24
tracymixed tracymixed is offline
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Default Re: Who is the weakest untrained man that could beat Valentina Shevchenko?

as much as i like the idea of a smaller woman defeating a much larger/muscular but less skilled man, there's just a lack of video evidence that makes me think otherwise.
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Old 05-May-21, 09:08
Elbow Escape Elbow Escape is offline
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Default Re: Who is the weakest untrained man that could beat Valentina Shevchenko?

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Originally Posted by tracymixed [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
as much as i like the idea of a smaller woman defeating a much larger/muscular but less skilled man, there's just a lack of video evidence that makes me think otherwise.
How much larger and muscular are you talking about?
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Old 05-May-21, 23:26
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Default Re: Who is the weakest untrained man that could beat Valentina Shevchenko?

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Originally Posted by Elbow Escape [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
How much larger and muscular are you talking about?
There is also a gulf between Valentina and "elite female fighters". She just made Jessica Andrade look average. A former 115 champion who has smashed plenty of very good fighters herself.

Claudia Gadelha dominated a significantly bigger, more muscular man but again, she is nowhere near the level of Valentina.

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Old 06-May-21, 08:02
Elbow Escape Elbow Escape is offline
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Default Re: Who is the weakest untrained man that could beat Valentina Shevchenko?

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Originally Posted by jiminy [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
There is also a gulf between Valentina and "elite female fighters". She just made Jessica Andrade look average. A former 115 champion who has smashed plenty of very good fighters herself.
I know, her and Amanda are pretty much in a league of their own, that's why I used her for this discussion.

By the way I think that many people don't fully realize how many levels and gulfs there are to fighting, that's why you can find people who claim that Valentina could not beat some random big gym goer because a renowned session wrestler they know once failed to do so and stuff like that.
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Old 09-May-21, 03:26
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Default Re: Who is the weakest untrained man that could beat Valentina Shevchenko?

No man can beat her without trainning man... fight is not only strenght. But for example she probably get her ass beat so bad by any MMA guy...
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Old 09-May-21, 03:34
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Default Re: Who is the weakest untrained man that could beat Valentina Shevchenko?

Anytime she wants some, she can come and get some.
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Old 09-May-21, 09:40
Elbow Escape Elbow Escape is offline
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Default Re: Who is the weakest untrained man that could beat Valentina Shevchenko?

Quote:
Originally Posted by polbe [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
No man can beat her without trainning man... fight is not only strenght.
So you think even a 350 lbs elite strenght athlete could not beat her without training?
I disagree, I believe she would have zero chance and be overwhelmed easily.

As a small guy who trained BJJ and defeated guys literally twice my size I know very well that fighting is not only strenght and that technique and skills can overcame truly huge size and strenght disadvantages, but there are still limits.

Quote:
But for example she probably get her ass beat so bad by any MMA guy..
Do you mean by any UFC fighter, any professional fighter in general or by any random guy who train in MMA?
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