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  #41  
Old 16-Jan-16, 19:57
brooksie brooksie is offline
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Default Re: My four biggest pet peeves in m/f fighting stories

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Originally Posted by rvwrestlling [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
It's all fantasy, take enjoy what you like and leave what you don't like.
I'm never sure what the point of a post like this is. You see them all the time. I believe the intent is to try and shut down dialogue. They are usually dismissive in tone and belittling towards the OP. You see phrases like:
"what's the big deal?" "move on if you don't like it" or "it's all fantasy", which is, to me, code for it's all good.

If you can't comment on what you do or don't like in a story, on a story forum, what's the use of having it in the first place. I agree with Mongoose, in writing and other forms of art, details make a tremendous difference. It also matters how you set the story up. If the opening sequence involves giant amazon women from outer space, then your going to sound a bit clueless playing the reality card. But if your story is set up to be a "slice of reality" type of tale, then you've got an obligation to keep it real.

As for bad writing, poor grammar, misspellings etc, that just makes me less likely to want to continue reading. I lose faith the author is trying their best to tell a good tale and is either lazy or indifferent. I can't write at all unless I'm engaged and ready to put the reader first by trying to be self-critical and think like the reader. Little things do matter. For example, in the opening sentences of the first two paragraphs, I used the word "point". Reading back, I noticed the repetition and changed one of the "points" to another word. I wrote "in writing and other forms of art the details can make a tremendous difference". I realized "the" wasn't necessary and removed it, just because I thought it made the sentence read better. I understand some people don't care about beauty, accuracy or even basic language skills like spelling and grammar but a lot of us do and that's why we engage in discussions like this. If you aren't interested in that, fine but spare us the "it's all good" dictum, if you please.

Language can be beautiful, words can be beautiful. Yes it's all fantasy but think of the good fantasy writers you've read, science fiction and the like - does that give them a license to be lazy or sloppy? No, it does not. They are reviewed to the same standards every other author is.

Last edited by brooksie; 16-Jan-16 at 20:09. Reason: sp
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  #42  
Old 16-Jan-16, 23:28
JEPelerin JEPelerin is offline
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Default Re: My four biggest pet peeves in m/f fighting stories

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Originally Posted by brooksie [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
I'm never sure what the point of a post like this is. You see them all the time. I believe the intent is to try and shut down dialogue. They are usually dismissive in tone and belittling towards the OP. You see phrases like:
"what's the big deal?" "move on if you don't like it" or "it's all fantasy", which is, to me, code for it's all good.

If you can't comment on what you do or don't like in a story, on a story forum, what's the use of having it in the first place.
For me the problem is that the OP was a mix of complaints. Peeves 1 & 4 (excessive sound effects and mechanical lists of actions (in this case wrestling moves) are, arguably, poor writing style that should either be avoided entirely or used with great care.

Peeves 2 & 3, however, especially when accompanied by comments such as "why do these stories keep cropping up?? Who is sitting at home writing this stuff" are complaints about subject matter and appear to be suggesting that there ought to be no "wrestling fanfic" or wrestling scenarios involving "fantasy" elements at all. That is pretty extreme (if there was a general list of "pet peeves about amateur fiction on the internet" that included "m/f fighting stories" and the query "why do such stories get written at all?" I'm guessing most of us would be justifiably annoyed).

It is to such complaints about subject matter (rather than the style in which those subjects are written) that should, IMO, be met with comments along the lines of "if you don't care for it just don't read it".

TLDR: Stories about topics that don't interest me should be tolerated. Badly written stories of any sort should not. The fact that a m/f fighting story involves elements that don't interest me, or actually turn me off, does not make it badly written.
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  #43  
Old 17-Jan-16, 01:18
brooksie brooksie is offline
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Default Re: My four biggest pet peeves in m/f fighting stories

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Originally Posted by JEPelerin [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
For me the problem is that the OP was a mix of complaints. Peeves 1 & 4 (excessive sound effects and mechanical lists of actions (in this case wrestling moves) are, arguably, poor writing style that should either be avoided entirely or used with great care.

Peeves 2 & 3, however, especially when accompanied by comments such as "why do these stories keep cropping up?? Who is sitting at home writing this stuff" are complaints about subject matter and appear to be suggesting that there ought to be no "wrestling fanfic" or wrestling scenarios involving "fantasy" elements at all. That is pretty extreme (if there was a general list of "pet peeves about amateur fiction on the internet" that included "m/f fighting stories" and the query "why do such stories get written at all?" I'm guessing most of us would be justifiably annoyed).

It is to such complaints about subject matter (rather than the style in which those subjects are written) that should, IMO, be met with comments along the lines of "if you don't care for it just don't read it".

TLDR: Stories about topics that don't interest me should be tolerated. Badly written stories of any sort should not. The fact that a m/f fighting story involves elements that don't interest me, or actually turn me off, does not make it badly written.
I agree with that. I sometimes shake my head at some of the more out-there stuff but saying it shouldn't exist is not something I'd ever do. As I said on my wrestling video review thread, people like what they like and that's fine with me. I know not everyone likes my style because they actually prefer to read about impossible things that couldn't happen in real life.

But in this case, the complaint was most assuredly about writing style, not a question of a topic the poster didn't find appealing. There I think you're right. I just move on and don't waste any time wondering why someone wrote in the first place.
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  #44  
Old 17-Jan-16, 02:35
Alexios Alexios is offline
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Default Re: My four biggest pet peeves in m/f fighting stories

Pet peeves could be divided into 2 categories. One category is on things that are just bad writing which should just be avoided. Those should be pointed out and criticized and would help writers improve their writing in general, not just wrestling stories.

The second category is on matters of taste, pointing out elements in stories that the reader doesn't like. These should still be allowed to be expressed. There's nothing objectively wrong with fantasy mixed wrestling stories but there is also nothing wrong for saying that those aren't one's cup of tea.
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  #45  
Old 17-Jan-16, 13:16
rvwrestlling rvwrestlling is offline
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Default Re: My four biggest pet peeves in m/f fighting stories

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Originally Posted by Mongoose750 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Fantasy or not, it's no excuse for not writing your best. Think what would happen if they had that attitude while making movies.
Oh, wait a minute, a lot of them do.
Well write your best anyway.
I don't disagree with you, but everyone has a different degree of writing ability and creative ideas.

A lot of fans don't care much about quality writing. Look at ScissorVixens, same scenario every time, but they sell a lot of videos. Look at Grappling Girls, pretty much the same thing.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not discounting your opinion. I read the remarks here from various fans and believe me I consider them seriously. But those of you who voice your opinions about what you like and don't like are in a very small minority of fans.

I've had fans send me scripts, ideas and short storylines. Some I try out. Some work well, some don't.

A lot of producers advertise here, yet I don't see a lot of members remarking on particular good or bad videos. So I judge the fan's likes and dislikes a lot on sales.

Thank you to all the members who are contributing to this thread. It's always good to get feedback.
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  #46  
Old 17-Jan-16, 13:25
rvwrestlling rvwrestlling is offline
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Default Re: My four biggest pet peeves in m/f fighting stories

Quote:
Originally Posted by brooksie [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
I'm never sure what the point of a post like this is. You see them all the time. I believe the intent is to try and shut down dialogue. They are usually dismissive in tone and belittling towards the OP. You see phrases like:
"what's the big deal?" "move on if you don't like it" or "it's all fantasy", which is, to me, code for it's all good.
Code? Sorry, I don't deal in code. I'm not trying to shut down dialogue. In fact, I would like to see more comments from more members.

More private communications would be good too. I'm not sure how many of the companies who advertise here even bother to look at other parts of the forum, like here. Posting here is no guarantee that you're reaching the audience you're trying to reach.

Thanks for your input and that of other members like you.

It is all fantasy. If you and others didn't have fantasies about this fetish or others like it, then there wouldn't be the plethora of videos, session girls, stories, websites, etc. out there.
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  #47  
Old 17-Jan-16, 18:45
jstewart jstewart is offline
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Default Re: My four biggest pet peeves in m/f fighting stories

Quote:
Originally Posted by brooksie [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
I agree with that. I sometimes shake my head at some of the more out-there stuff but saying it shouldn't exist is not something I'd ever do. As I said on my wrestling video review thread, people like what they like and that's fine with me. I know not everyone likes my style because they actually prefer to read about impossible things that couldn't happen in real life.

But in this case, the complaint was most assuredly about writing style, not a question of a topic the poster didn't find appealing. There I think you're right. I just move on and don't waste any time wondering why someone wrote in the first place.
TO BROOKSIE
I want to thank you for your stories and everyone elses stories ,if people don't like the stories they don't have to read them.U CANT PLEASE EVERYONE
JAMES
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  #48  
Old 17-Jan-16, 20:27
brooksie brooksie is offline
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Default Re: My four biggest pet peeves in m/f fighting stories

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Originally Posted by jstewart [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
TO BROOKSIE
I want to thank you for your stories and everyone elses stories ,if people don't like the stories they don't have to read them.U CANT PLEASE EVERYONE
JAMES
The trouble is, when you write "if people don't like the stories they don't have to read them", then what you're really saying is "don't post about anything you don't like, just move on."

I find that a bit anti-social. This is a discussion board, so one would expect all aspects of stories, story-writing, story preferences etc to be discussed here. The forum has rules and a moderator to govern those discussions. As I said in an earlier post, what's the point of having a forum if you get a regular dose of "if you don't like it, move on." You might as well be yelling "SHUT UP". The other thing is, you often don't find out there are things in a story that you don't like until you've already begun reading it, so it's a little late to "just move on" at that stage.

Let's stop trying to shut down the discussion on a discussion board. Let others speak, let them have their say and disagree with them if you feel inclined. But don't try to stop people from expressing their opinions, otherwise this will be just a place for people to post their stories, not a discussion board about stories.
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  #49  
Old 17-Jan-16, 22:47
jimp jimp is offline
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Default Re: My four biggest pet peeves in m/f fighting stories

Interesting discussion and a bit depressing to find that I've probably committed many of these especially 1 and to a lesser extent 3 in the original post (can I add excessive use of unexplained abbreviations to the list?).

On point 1, I am probably guilty of most of using sound effects because to be honest I don't know how to add the dramatic emphasis that this provides. Yes, I am a bad writer and know it but I try my best.

On point 3, on the rare occasions that I've used this device it has always been tongue in-cheek with the character names thinly disguised just for a bit of light relief from my usual stuff.

Several people in this thread appear to be making the assumption that we are all professional writers and therefore should possess a high level of writing skills. Far from it. I have never considered myself to be a good writer and am learning what works and what doesn't as I go along. I always try my best and I do proof-read what I write - sites that have spell-checkers are also quite good for an additional check.

Feedback from readers is also useful to provide some idea where I've written something that people like and where I haven't - especially if it is constructive criticism that I can use to try to improve in the future.

All I can say is keep on reading and give us constructive feedback that will encourage us to become better writers.

Last edited by jimp; 17-Jan-16 at 22:49. Reason: grammar
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  #50  
Old 18-Jan-16, 00:02
brooksie brooksie is offline
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Default Re: My four biggest pet peeves in m/f fighting stories

"Several people in this thread appear to be making the assumption that we are all professional writers and therefore should possess a high level of writing skills."

I have been a professional writer for a large part of my working life in the media. I'm perfectly aware than many people who write stories for sites like this are not. They're exploring their fantasies through writing about them. When someone is obviously not an experienced writer it poses a problem for those of us who have done a lot of writing: do you point out the flaws with the intention of helping them become better writers or do you simply move on because many people on boards such as this will resent your efforts? I'll give it a shot and see what happens.

Example:

"...untold heavy pounds of huge womanhood..."

So I gather she was a large woman?

Seriously, this is a case of over-writing, not only making the point but driving it home with a sledge hammer. My advice would be to use as few words as possible to get the idea across and try not to fill the page with repetition, redundancy and just over-stating things in general. Otherwise you end up with phrases like the one above.
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