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Old 16-May-21, 11:48
Elbow Escape Elbow Escape is offline
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Default Men vs women comparison in soccer

A while ago I guy I knew who played soccer for most of his life and is very passionate, analytic minded and objective when discussing about it told me that the difference between man and woman is soccer is so huge that, in his opinion, "most men who just played a bit among friends for fun are better than professional female soccer players".

I point out that he is not the kind of person who can't accept the tought of losing in a fight to a woman, for example he has no problem admitting that a woman who is good at boxing or MMA would easily wreck a man with no training like he is.

Since I don't know much about soccer I was wondering if it's true or if he was underestimating women, and if it's true why the difference is so huge compared to other athletic activities.

I mean, I get that very few women are interested in soccer while an huge number of men are, so combine that with men's biological advantage and at professional leves the difference in performance is obviously going to be astronomical, but are really regular men who are not even good enough to play in an actual team and just play once in a while with friends better than female professionals?

Do you agree with him? If yes, can you explain me why the gap is so particularly wide?
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Old 16-May-21, 16:17
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jiminy jiminy is offline
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Default Re: Men vs women comparison in soccer

I know @[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] provided a lot of links of girls/womens sides beating boys/mens last year.

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

You can probably find many more examples by searching football/soccer in this sub-forum.

So your friend is factually wrong.

I've also heard ignorant guys - arm chair experts - say similar things. You can go from watching mens Football - the big teams in Europe - to women's and the quality is visibly inferior. The women are playing at a much slower pace, less physical, athletic and technical.

Because of this, people think professional women are a lot worse than they actually are.

Check out this vid. [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] - Mixed relay where a female is visibly slower and blown away on the last leg. Ignorant guys might come away with the notion that she couldn't even beat boys in the park, such was her inferiority to elite males.

Another psychological reason that I recently touched on in the thread High School Wrestling Profiles is that because he is so passionate about Football and has invested so much time and energy into it, he sees it as his sport, where he is the authority - his accumulated knowledge is respected and revered.

When you see an activity as a manly, macho domain, it can be very unsettling for a female to come along and "burst your bubble" so to speak.

When I was at school back in the 90s, early 2000s, there was no girls Football here in the UK. Boys played Football, Rugby and Cricket. Girls played Netball, Field Hockey, Rounders and had Gymnastics too. Boys had their lane, girls had theirs. Everyone respected it and that was that.

A girl playing Football? Put away such silly fantasies. It's not for girls and even if we let them play, they wouldn't be any good at it. It was a game invented by men for men, tailored to men's strengths. Same as the Boy Scouts. Camping out, making fires, tying knots, special handshakes. It's a male sanctuary. We don't want girls interfering.

When you're actually confronted with the scenario of having dedicated so much of your life's time, passion and energy to a pursuit. Had successes, received compliments, earned respect amongst your male peers, etc. ...And now a young, fresh faced, feminine, girly girl ties up her bouncy hair and performs said activity better than you ever could - or ever will - is a crushing experience.

That's the modern world for you. Being born male doesn't carry the birthrights it did for previous generations. It's a serious topic. Male suicide rates are worrisome. Young men are struggling to find their place in this world. It's not the world it was for previous generations.

Boomers can sprout outdated, sexist opinions all they want, but they are long retired. They're not the ones having to go out there and lose out, get humiliated by the supposed "fairer sex". Boomers might ridicule such "wimps" because it never happened to them but fail to see the world was set up so that it wouldn't. Girls were discouraged from being strong and "showing up boys" -- now they're encouraged and celebrated for doing so. The beaten males are paraded around like a "trophy kills" on the superior girl's social media for all to see.

Many of us wish we could just go back to the way things were because in the cold light of day ignorance really can be bliss.
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Old 16-May-21, 16:37
Elbow Escape Elbow Escape is offline
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Default Re: Men vs women comparison in soccer

Quote:
Originally Posted by jiminy [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
I know @[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] provided a lot of links of girls/womens sides beating boys/mens last year.

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

You can probably find many more examples by searching football/soccer in this sub-forum.

So your friend is factually wrong.

I've also heard ignorant guys - arm chair experts - say similar things. You can go from watching mens Football - the big teams in Europe - to women's and the quality is visibly inferior. The women are playing at a much slower pace, less physical, athletic and technical.

Because of this, people think professional women are a lot worse than they actually are.

Check out this vid. [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] - Mixed relay where a female is visibly slower and blown away on the last leg. Ignorant guys might come away with the notion that she couldn't even beat boys in the park, such was her inferiority to elite males.

Another psychological reason that I recently touched on in the thread High School Wrestling Profiles is that because he is so passionate about Football and has invested so much time and energy into it, he sees it as his sport, where he is the authority - his accumulated knowledge is respected and revered.

When you see an activity as a manly, macho domain, it can be very unsettling for a female to come along and "burst your bubble" so to speak.

When I was at school back in the 90s, early 2000s, there was no girls Football here in the UK. Boys played Football, Rugby and Cricket. Girls played Netball, Field Hockey, Rounders and had Gymnastics too. Boys had their lane, girls had theirs. Everyone respected it and that was that.

A girl playing Football? Put away such silly fantasies. It's not for girls and even if we let them play, they wouldn't be any good at it. It was a game invented by men for men, tailored to men's strengths. Same as the Boy Scouts. Camping out, making fires, tying knots, special handshakes. It's a male sanctuary. We don't want girls interfering.

When you're actually confronted with the scenario of having dedicated so much of your life's time, passion and energy to a pursuit. Had successes, received compliments, earned respect amongst your male peers, etc. ...And now a young, fresh faced, feminine, girly girl ties up her bouncy hair and performs said activity better than you ever could - or ever will - is a crushing experience.

That's the modern world for you. Being born male doesn't carry the birthrights it did for previous generations. It's a serious topic. Male suicide rates are worrisome. Young men are struggling to find their place in this world. It's not the world it was for previous generations.

Boomers can sprout outdated, sexist opinions all they want, but they are long retired. They're not the ones having to go out there and lose out, get humiliated by the supposed "fairer sex". Boomers might ridicule such "wimps" because it never happened to them but fail to see the world was set up so that it wouldn't. Girls were discouraged from being strong and "showing up boys" -- now they're encouraged and celebrated for doing so. The beaten males are paraded around like a "trophy kills" on the superior girl's social media for all to see.

Many of us wish we could just go back to the way things were because in the cold light of day ignorance really can be bliss.
Thanks, I will check out the links later when I'm on my pc.

So in your opinion professional females are comparable to what level of men?
For example National level women are comparable to Fourth division/Serie D men? Or they are lower than that?
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Old 16-May-21, 18:45
Amazonia Amazonia is offline
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Default Re: Men vs women comparison in soccer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elbow Escape [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
For example National level women are comparable to Fourth division/Serie D men? Or they are lower than that?
You can't compare national football to club football because the latter is always going to be superior on a comparable level of players. National teams only train together for a limited part of the year and they don't have the team chemistry and polished tactics, meanwhile clubs train together daily and work on their tactics and they also have the options to buy new players for positions they need. So club teams are much more balanced and better prepared. National teams play more for prestige than for quality. Even elite men's teams like Italy would struggle against well prepared and well balanced second division teams of elite leagues, despite having much better players on paper.

So these women's national teams like USA and Australia losing to club youth teams is not as bad as people think as these teams don't train together a lot and need friendly games to get prepared, while the boys were carefully selected and used to play as a team and it was the biggest game of their lives to that point.

It would only be fair to compare best female clubs to male clubs, but this is also a bit unfair because top European men's leagues are filled with money and talent from all over the world, while in women's leagues it's still mostly local women. For example look at the Serie A winners Inter and how many Italians they have in their team. Very little. I think they have only 1 Italian player in starting 11, the rest is elite foreign "mercenaries" that were carefully selected from all over the world. Meanwhile top women's teams are still mostly women from their country, with only a handful of foreign women. For example Bayern MŁnchen's women's team (German female champions) is mostly local German women, Bayern's men's team is a bunch of foreigners and a few German players, Barcelona women's team that will play in women's Champions League final is almost entirely local Spanish women, while men's Barcelona team relies on foreign talent like Messi, ter Stegen and de Jong that they scout from other countries. Men's teams just have million more options to choose from, because there are more men playing football.

If you look at Italian football leagues like Serie A, it's not really an "Italian" league anymore, it's a global league that happens to be played in Italy and the top clubs mostly have players who are not Italian. So these Serie D players would in normal circumstances play much higher in Italian football, but because the clubs in top divisions bought so much foreign talented players they're now playing lower. But with women the talent pool is not nearly as big and they're mostly just using local players. For every woman there's probably like 100 men playing in the world.

The only fair comparisons are on lower level where you have men and women from a similar talent pool competing against each other. There was an interesting game I found where a Slovenian 2nd division U19 boys lost 3:2 to the women's first division team of their same town.
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As you can see from the photos of the match, the men look much bigger and the women are not much older than them, in some cases even younger:
[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
The girl who scored the second goal was only 20 and the girl who scored the winning goal was 17.

The senior team of the second division male club could probably beat the women's team, but likely not by much. It's definitely telling that the senior men's team never wanted to avenge their U19 team lol.

Last edited by Amazonia; 16-May-21 at 18:56.
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Old 22-Jan-22, 07:07
Females are superior
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Default Re: Men vs women comparison in soccer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amazonia [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Just how embarrassed do you think he felt after this loss? Considering his career went completely downhill afterwards, I wouldn't be surprised if this defeat to Patty damaged him psychologically.
The fact that the defeat was so public and he was so overconfident before the match must have destroyed him psychologically. He can thank his lucky stars he didn't have to face the 18-year-old girl or the humiliation could have been even worse.

Added after 18 minutes:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elbow Escape [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Thanks, I will check out the links later when I'm on my pc.

So in your opinion professional females are comparable to what level of men?
For example National level women are comparable to Fourth division/Serie D men? Or they are lower than that?
Skills-wise the difference is not as big as you might think, especially when you consider the pool of female players is much smaller and even at the higher levels women struggle to make a living out of the sport. There was a study on penalty kicks at top level soccer and it turns out the conversion rate is practically identical. You might argue that male goalkeepers are taller, but the percentage of penalty kicks that miss the goal is also practically identical.

Even without stats you only have to watch games to see top male players who can't even reach the box when they take a corner kick while some female players deliver perfectly calibrated kicks (even though the girls are much smaller), many male players who kick it to the clouds when they shoot from outside the box while many female players score real peaches from that distance, or very expensive male signings who embarrass themselves at their presentations by failing miserably to make three touches in a row while women break records makings thousands of touches. I think the increasing emphasis on physical strength in male soccer means they're not always as skilled as you would expect and can sometimes be embarrassed by females in that department.

Last edited by Females are superior; 23-Jan-22 at 18:23.
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Old 16-May-21, 16:47
Amazonia Amazonia is offline
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Default Re: Men vs women comparison in soccer

Quote:
Originally Posted by jiminy [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
I know @[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register] provided a lot of links of girls/womens sides beating boys/mens last year.

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

You can probably find many more examples by searching football/soccer in this sub-forum.
Most examples that I posted are in this thread:
[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

Of course you need to give credit to "deepkick" too who did his share of work before I was around.

I also just found this recent match where a cocky u15 boys' team challenged Feyenoord reserve women who were mostly barely few years older than them and got thoroughly spanked 9:1 by the girls.
[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

The girls who scored were 16, 17, 18, 17, 17 and 16 years old at the time.

Here are the girls who play for this reserve team so you can check their age:
[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

I'm pretty sure that all those "males who played a bit with friends" would receive a similar hammering by these reserve women, yet alone elite pros.

Last edited by Amazonia; 16-May-21 at 16:57.
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Old 16-May-21, 16:59
Elbow Escape Elbow Escape is offline
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Smile Re: Men vs women comparison in soccer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amazonia [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Most examples that I posted are in this thread:
[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

Of course you need to give credit to "deepkick" too who did his share of work before I was around.

I also just found this recent match where a cocky u15 boys' team challenged Feyenoord reserve women and got thoroughly spanked 9:1 by the girls.
[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

I'm pretty sure that all those "males who played a bit with friends" would receive a similar hammering by women pros.
It's truly baffling how everyone and their grandmother, including people who could care less about soccer like myself, is aware that "the usa and australia national teams lost to high school boys" and it gets parroted around so much as a proof of men's unsormountable superiority while nobody ever mention those matches or know their existence.

It's almost as people don't want the notion and belief that women could beat men at a sport so popular and widely practiced among males to spread.
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Old 16-May-21, 17:08
Amazonia Amazonia is offline
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Default Re: Men vs women comparison in soccer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elbow Escape [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
It's truly baffling how everyone and their grandmother, including people who could care less about soccer like myself, is aware that "the usa and australia national teams lost to high school boys" and it gets parroted around continuosly as a proof of men's unsormountable superiority while nobody ever mention those matches.

It's almost as people don't want the notion and belief that women could beat men at a sport so popular and widely practiced among males to spread.
I updated the post since you quoted it so I hope you didn't miss this part that I added:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amazonia [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
The girls who scored were 16, 17, 18, 17, 17 and 16 years old at the time.

Here are the girls who play for this reserve team so you can check their age:
[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
So basically these u15 boys lost to a bunch of girls only 2 or 3 years older than them, and "losing" is actually not even the right word, they got hammered 9-1 which is above "one-sided", it's just a score that shouldn't even happen in soccer. Basically a mismatch and a waste of girls' time. Well at least the boys learned a valuable lesson in humility and respect.

I guess these u15 boys got encouraged by those few matches of US and Australian women's team losing to boys their age that as you say keep getting mentioned like propaganda, and got a humiliating lesson served for their ignorance. I bet they regret calling out the Feyenoord girls haha

It's really hilarious that they keep bringing up these matches of US and Australian women making it look as if any U15 boys can win, while there are many cases of u15 girls competing in u15 boys' leagues and winning. For example this Dutch girls' u15 team kept trashing the boys' u15 league teams:
[Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]

If you check their youtube channel there are many more of such matches and they win 90% of them. Against boys their age!

I think for many average untrained men it's actually easier to accept losing to women in BJJ/wrestling than in football, because very few of them trained grappling while football is widely practiced by the majority of men in Europe and beyond, so they don't really have excuses of now knowing the sport.
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Old 17-May-21, 16:13
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Default Re: Men vs women comparison in soccer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amazonia [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
It's really hilarious that they keep bringing up these matches of US and Australian women making it look as if any U15 boys can win, while there are many cases of u15 girls competing in u15 boys' leagues and winning. For example this Dutch girls' u15 team kept trashing the boys' u15 league teams:
whatís genuinely funny is you and others here (ik itís a fetish forum but come on) picking and choosing obscure examples to try and hide the best team of womenís soccer players in the world losing to 15 year olds. who gives a shit if theyíre occasionally competitive at 16 in tiny dutch clubs when the best WNT in the world can lose handily to a (terrible) MLS teamís academy?
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Old 17-May-21, 19:01
joha7 joha7 is offline
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Default Re: Men vs women comparison in soccer

In response to the OP, I actually think the performance gap between boys’ and girls’ soccer is smaller than most other sports. The biggest differences in men and womens athletic genetics are:

Height (Average US male is 5 inches taller than female)

Upperbody Strength (Men are about 2x stronger iirc, the gap in leg strength is not quite as large)

Explosiveness (Max speed, Vertical Jump, Punching force etc.)

These aspects aren’t really as important in soccer as they are in stuff like basketball, football, track and field, etc. Soccer has a heavier focus on endurance and fundamental skills where the gap between boys and girls isn’t as big. Lots of girls will have better endurance over an 80-90 minute match. And lots of girls will have better coordination, dribbling, passing, and teamwork than boys, especially if they play for top level clubs while the boys play more casually.

It’s a lot different in sports like basketball however. Once boys start to hit puberty, they get huge advantage. In a sport with a 10 foot rim, having a 5 inch height advantage, longer armspan, and the ability to run faster and jump higher is a massive advantage. Basketball also has a faster pace and much smaller playing area than soccer, making the athletic advantage more noticeable. Once you get to the varsity high school level, it almost feels like the boys are playing a completely different sport.
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