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View Poll Results: Who is the best female submission wrestler of all times?
Judell Du Long 19 5.34%
Beatrice Goffin 9 2.53%
Maggie Jennings 4 1.12%
Sonia Fernandez 33 9.27%
Raquel 50 14.04%
Helen Von Mott 79 22.19%
Shannon Logan 39 10.96%
Kathy Gifford 35 9.83%
Nadege 22 6.18%
Liz Lightspeed 39 10.96%
Tiffany 27 7.58%
Voters: 356. You may not vote on this poll

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  #51  
Old 03-Jan-20, 21:31
pinme pinme is offline
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Default Re: Best Female Submission Wrestler of All Times

I have sessioned with all ten of Helen’s top ten. My only disagreement is that I think Yasmin would beat Kathy. When Helen made her list, Yasmin was a bjj blue belt. Later, she got her black belt. Of course, they all beat me, which is all I really care about.

Last edited by pinme; 03-Jan-20 at 21:56.
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  #52  
Old 04-Jan-20, 12:01
jfm jfm is offline
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Default Re: Best Female Submission Wrestler of All Times

This has been an interesting thread to read. It introduced me to some of the great wrestlers of the past I never knew of or had the chance to meet. There is one name that I'm surprised is not mentioned. Again someone I never met, so only know her from what I've read. Everything I've ever read says Fabi Antonie was as close to invincible as any woman ever. She world class judo skills, nearly unmatched size and power and brought a level of ferocity that could be scary. Fabi didn't do a lot of video work and I have no idea how she traveled, that maybe why she didn't make the pole.
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  #53  
Old 04-Jan-20, 12:13
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verscont verscont is offline
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Default Re: Best Female Submission Wrestler of All Times

Her name is actually Fabi Antoine. I'm not having a go at your spelling, it's just that I'd never heard of her and my googling threw up that name instead. But I'll have to take your word about her wrestling and judo skills because the search images are solely of her FBB career.
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  #54  
Old 04-Jan-20, 14:25
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Armwrestlefan99 Armwrestlefan99 is offline
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Default Re: Best Female Submission Wrestler of All Times

I suppose there would be a few contenders who have been on the scene that haven't got involved much or at all with competitive female vs female videos.

As well as Fabi Antoine, Izabella Mendes is another now who is a top judoka I know. I think in the USA Master Kayla is said to be very good and doesn't do videos either. Amber Deluca's video involvement has been very limited I think hasn't it too? Maybe Dez Desire too thus far?

So for girls like these it would depend on testimonies of guys who had sessions with them, or experts like Helen. I'm not sure if Yasmin got involved much in all-female matches did she (I seem to recall she was in a video with Kasie Cavanaugh but it seemed to be catfight style and possibly not fully competitive from what I could tell - I didn't end up buying it anyway but think I noticed it was available at some point).

Then there are obviously some new candidates that emerged or developed after Zweig opened the thread and made the video, and/or that Helen might not have known much about. Diana from Fight Pulse of course, Ariel X, Jenny Sjodin, Ola, Kaysha Brazil for example.

I don't think I could make a good guess at the answer, and it depends also on whether we're just talking about skills or about overall effectiveness surely. If Helen did actually make a comeback in top shape I guess it'd be good to see her in some matches with new girls - maybe Zweig would invite her to Fight Pulse to see Diana for example!

Just from girls I had a session with I probably find it too hard - maybe I'd make a list of 11 myself and say it could possibly be any of them potentially at their best or they could all be fairly close - alphabetically it'd be like this (without considering Ina Black or Dominique Danger actually either due to the session format not giving a good enough impression, but I think DD might even have won vs Helen one time didn't she, although maybe it was post Helen's peak?)
Chloe Davis
Kasie Cavanaugh
Kathy Gifford
Madam Mysteria
Mayra Conde
Severa
Sheena
Tia
Venom
Viktoria
Warrior Amazone

Taking it up to 20 names with honourable mentions in the same way Zweig did (except he wasn't just thinking of girls from his own sessions!) I'd add these and to be honest Calista probably fits better in the main group anyway, even if more because of her strength than skills. I'd doubt they are candidates for the best I ever had a session with, but they'd be in close contention probably at their best.
Calista
Cindy Huntress
Fire (LWS)
Jet
Kassidy
KO
Maggie Jennings
Malibu
Shelby Beach

Maybe I wouldn't rule out Ms Xena from that group though because she is very strong and knows some judo moves too I think, and maybe Panther from a few years before I had sessions with her could fit there too, because I think she had had some injuries but she's another who didn't do much in the way of competitive videos, especially all-female matches anyway.

I wouldn't be too surprised if the best I had a session with might be deemed to be the same as Helen's number 1 from her most skilled list, Kathy Gifford. I have a feeling Venom felt Kathy was better than herself for example. But again she has more of a history of female matches to refer to than Severa for example.
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  #55  
Old 04-Jan-20, 18:10
boyofwinter boyofwinter is offline
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Default Re: Best Female Submission Wrestler of All Times

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfm [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Everything I've ever read says Fabi Antoine was as close to invincible as any woman ever.
Helen certainly knew of her, so I'd guess either she doesn't think much of judo players (not very likely) or she didn't include her because she was talking about ladies who would competitively wrestle with other ladies who did sessions. Or it could be she assumed Fabi had stopped training to concentrate on bodybuilding, something like that. There are quite a few great ones who weren't in the poll as others have pointed out.
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  #56  
Old 04-Jan-20, 19:26
pinme pinme is offline
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Default Re: Best Female Submission Wrestler of All Times

I will add MMA fighter Mallory Sin (Debi Purcell) to the list. (She was ok with her name being revealed.). Hard to imagine anyone beating her. She told me she enjoyed wrestling me because it was so “relaxing.”
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  #57  
Old 11-Jan-20, 11:41
jfm jfm is offline
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Default Re: Best Female Submission Wrestler of All Times

Quote:
Originally Posted by boyofwinter [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Helen certainly knew of her, so I'd guess either she doesn't think much of judo players (not very likely) or she didn't include her because she was talking about ladies who would competitively wrestle with other ladies who did sessions. Or it could be she assumed Fabi had stopped training to concentrate on bodybuilding, something like that. There are quite a few great ones who weren't in the poll as others have pointed out.
Does make me wonder what Helen's thoughts are on Fabi.

Quote:
Originally Posted by verscont [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Her name is actually Fabi Antoine. I'm not having a go at your spelling, it's just that I'd never heard of her and my googling threw up that name instead. But I'll have to take your word about her wrestling and judo skills because the search images are solely of her FBB career.
I apologize for butchering the spelling.
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  #58  
Old 11-Jan-20, 12:15
paul tea paul tea is offline
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Default Re: Best Female Submission Wrestler of All Times

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfm [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
This has been an interesting thread to read. It introduced me to some of the great wrestlers of the past I never knew of or had the chance to meet. There is one name that I'm surprised is not mentioned. Again someone I never met, so only know her from what I've read. Everything I've ever read says Fabi Antonie was as close to invincible as any woman ever. She world class judo skills, nearly unmatched size and power and brought a level of ferocity that could be scary. Fabi didn't do a lot of video work and I have no idea how she traveled, that maybe why she didn't make the pole.
I met fabi many years ago. she is very strong as power. I beat her in armwrestling, but I am strong in armwrestling, but was not easy. I think she is in my top10 of armwrestling (and I met many strong women in armwrestling, th-resa bostick, anna m,strong,renata hronova,ms xena, musclefox jenny,dominique danger,amazon annie, dominick black,...).
in mixed wrestling she is fantastic...no chance for me. I don't remember exactly but sure she submit me more 5 times in 1 hour
one of better wrestler I met
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beatrice goffin, best wrestler, community, helen von mott, judell du long, kathy gifford, liz lightspeed, maggie jennings, nadege, poll, raquel, shannon logan, sonia fernandez, tiffany

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