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  #21  
Old 25-Mar-21, 17:48
Freeman20 Freeman20 is offline
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Default Re: How many extra pounds does a women need to be as strong as a man?

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Originally Posted by Elbow Escape [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Why does it bother you if I compare elite level women with not elite level men?
Everyone know that most men are stronger than most women and that elite men are stronger than elite women, there is no point in talking about that.
My point was precisely that elite level women are stronger than most men, a point that you previously deemed as "impossible".
Then you were proved wrong and moved the goalpost to "eh but it doesn't really count since they are steroids".


And actually there are even examples of top level women outperforming elite level, but not top level men, in feats of strenght, like you can see in this post from another user:
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I find very hard to believe that women who are stronger than male national weightlifting champions would become weaker than the average guy if you take away sterioids.



Then I guess this late 1800 women were on steroids too:




By the way strenght doesn't necessarily correlate with muscle mass, so there are women without a a very muscular, bodybuilder-like physique who are still stronger than most men.
I would say that's more rare and difficult for a natural women to reach a very muscular physique than to reach a very high level of strenght.

Also, what is exactly a "couch potato" in your book?
If you mean a man that doesn't do sport or athletic activities that build his strenght than most men are couch potatoes, which would only reinforce my point that there are women stronger than most most men.
My main point was that a woman can't be as strong as a man by just gaining weight.

You take the discussion into so many directions which makes it difficult to keep it going.

What percentage would you say elite women represents? Like 1% of women? Ok. If you said there are a few women who are stronger than most men, that would be accurate.

Lastly, why don't female weightlifters and crossfitters compete against men? Same goes for soprts and martial arts. They can add as much weight as they want if that's the only reason they aren't as strong.
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  #22  
Old 25-Mar-21, 18:58
Elbow Escape Elbow Escape is offline
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Default Re: How many extra pounds does a women need to be as strong as a man?

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Originally Posted by Freeman20 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
What percentage would you say elite women represents? Like 1% of women? Ok. If you said there are a few women who are stronger than most men, that would be accurate.
But that's exactly my point, that there is a small minority of women that are stronger than most men, they are very rare but they exist.
You were the one who said it was impossible.

Quote:
You take the discussion into so many directions which makes it difficult to keep it going.
No, I didn't take the discussion in so many directions, there was always one direction.
I summarize it from the beginning:

-I started by saying that the "how much does a women need to weight to be as strong as a man?" question of the OP is pointless, because there a lot of other factors that determine how strong someone is other than weight, such as what this weight is made of (in what percentage this weight is muscles, bodyfat, skeleton size ecc...) and neuromuscular efficiency, which varies greatly even between peopele of the same weight and build.

To reinforce this point I stated that some women are stronger than some men despite weighing less than them, to show that's strenght it's not just a matter of how much someone weight.

To further reinforce the point that "weight alone doesn't mean much", I made the example of extremely rare elite women (such as Stefi Cohen) who are stronger than most men, including heavier men.

That's all, I hope it's more clear now.

Quote:
Lastly, why don't female weightlifters and crossfitters compete against men? Same goes for soprts and martial arts.
The reason is because men on average are a lot stronger than women, but keyword is "on average".
The average men is stronger than the average woman, and the strongest man is stronger than the strongest woman, however when talking about specific individuals there are some women stronger than some men, and there are even a few women stronger than the vast majority men.

A good comparison is with height, men are usually taller but there are some women taller than the average man, and there are also very rare cases of 6'7 women who are taller than almost every man.
Now it's more rare to find a women stronger than a man than to find a women taller than a man, yes, but the general concept still stand.

Quote:
They can add as much weight as they want if that's the only reason they aren't as strong.
Where the hell I said that weight is the only reason women are weaker?
My whole point revolved around how weight alone doesn't tell much regarding strenght.

Also I really don't get what you mean with the "if that's the only reason they are not as strong they can add as much weight as they want", what is that supposed to mean?
People can't gain infinite weight, unless you mean becoming obese by eating junk food al day which is obviously not going to help with your strenght or with your athletic performance.
How much weight of lean and fuctional muscle mass you can add is limited by your genetic.
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  #23  
Old 26-Mar-21, 03:49
Backdoorman Backdoorman is offline
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Default Re: How many extra pounds does a women need to be as strong as a man?

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Originally Posted by fr1fr1 [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Yet the weight categories in fighting sports/martial arts are very important if not essential?

Thus it means that at equal martial knowledge, weight is decisive?
The weight-classes assumes the two people in question have similar training and fitness. It still doesn't mean that there is significant correlation between weight and strength; there is often significant variance of strength within a weight-class.

On top of that, strength of itself is not the only deciding factor. If it was, then every fight can just be settled with a bench press and we don't have to deal with all the discomfort of getting punched in the face.
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  #24  
Old 26-Mar-21, 07:28
m111111m m111111m is offline
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Default Re: How many extra pounds does a women need to be as strong as a man?

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This feels like a good benchmark. very well trained 55 kg men apparently can lift more than very well trained women who are 20 kg heavier than them.
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  #25  
Old 28-Mar-21, 14:25
Freeman20 Freeman20 is offline
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Default Re: How many extra pounds does a women need to be as strong as a man?

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Originally Posted by m111111m [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
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This feels like a good benchmark. very well trained 55 kg men apparently can lift more than very well trained women who are 20 kg heavier than them.
And it's not even that close given the weight difference.
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  #26  
Old 19-Apr-21, 18:19
towerworld towerworld is offline
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Default Re: How many extra pounds does a women need to be as strong as a man?

Obviously alot of deluded wierdos ITT, me included. But on average Woman are about 40% weaker than men while being 15% lighter on average, meaning they would have to be 25% heavier to match strength in most cases.

That said, high level female athletes can be as strong or stronger than an average man at lighter weights such as weight lifters or fitness models. If the female and male are both equivalent power athletes however, you would need a very significant weight difference on the part of the female as male powerlifters in the 125 weight class often will lift as much or more than 250 pound females.
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  #27  
Old 21-Apr-21, 01:18
Elbow Escape Elbow Escape is offline
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Default Re: How many extra pounds does a women need to be as strong as a man?

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Originally Posted by towerworld [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
Obviously alot of deluded wierdos ITT, me included
I hope you are not talking about me, because I'm definitely a weirdo (otherwise I would not be debating about women's strenght on an online forum in the first place) but I didn't write anything delusional.

To me it seems that people who are skeptical because I stated that Stefi Cohen and other world class level female weightlifter of average weight are stronger than 99% of men forget how many men exist on this planet, and how few of them are dedicated weighlifters than can bench press more than 100 kg, squat more than 230 kg and deadlift more than 250 kg (likely less than 1 out of 100).
Being stronger than 99% of men still mean that there are millions of men stronger than her in the world.
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  #28  
Old 26-Apr-21, 17:18
towerworld towerworld is offline
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Default Re: How many extra pounds does a women need to be as strong as a man?

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Originally Posted by Elbow Escape [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
I hope you are not talking about me, because I'm definitely a weirdo (otherwise I would not be debating about women's strenght on an online forum in the first place) but I didn't write anything delusional.

To me it seems that people who are skeptical because I stated that Stefi Cohen and other world class level female weightlifter of average weight are stronger than 99% of men forget how many men exist on this planet, and how few of them are dedicated weighlifters than can bench press more than 100 kg, squat more than 230 kg and deadlift more than 250 kg (likely less than 1 out of 100).
Being stronger than 99% of men still mean that there are millions of men stronger than her in the world.
I wasn’t responding to you and i was not familliar with cohen previously. She’s very strong obviously but rather average I would say compared to experienced male powerlifters.
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  #29  
Old 04-May-21, 14:52
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Penny Lane Penny Lane is offline
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Default Re: How many extra pounds does a women need to be as strong as a man?

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Originally Posted by m111111m [Only Registered Users Can See LinksClick Here To Register]
...very well trained 55 kg men apparently can lift more than very well trained women who are 20 kg heavier than them.
True, but there are other factors that can make even more of a difference. Physiologically, a man's center of gravity runs across his shoulders; a woman's center is through her hips.

For that reason, a woman would be best off using her lower body when wrestling a man. This applies for offense, in which she uses her legs to trap him in holds......and for defense, where she uses her legs to push him off of her. Many women have the edge in leg strength, flexibility & agility over men, but don't make use of it.

In woman vs. man wrestling, you invariably see the gal trying to match arm strength with the guy, which is the worst thing she can do.

Sure, weight makes a difference in a fight but a much larger woman can still be defeated by a man if she doesn't use the advantages that nature gave her.
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  #30  
Old 04-May-21, 17:13
ca12345 ca12345 is offline
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Default Re: How many extra pounds does a women need to be as strong as a man?

I don’t think there is any kind of reliable formula for weight vs strength. It’s a lot more about the physical makeup of both people. Some people aren’t very well put together and their extra weight doesn’t add strength.
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